Uncut "stigma"

Discussion in 'Relationships, Discrimination, and Jealousy' started by snoozan, Nov 15, 2006.

  1. snoozan

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    Hi all,

    I'm posting about an issue that has become increasingly annoying to deal with.

    When my son was born, his father and I chose to not have him circumcised. There are a lot of well thought out reasons that we chose to do this, but now that the decision is made, they are somewhat immaterial.

    Thing thing that I am having a problem with is that when people find out that my son is not circumcised, I get a lot of shit for it. Here's a list of the common complaints.

    1. Kids will make fun of him! Everyone is circumcised and when they see that he's not, they will tease him mercilessly!

    2. Uncut penises are ugly! No one will want to have sex with him.

    3. He's a boy and boys can't be taught how to clean anything, especially their penises.

    4. He'll get cancer.

    5. He might have to get circumcised later and it will hurt him more then.

    6. He'll hate you for the rest of his life for keeping him intact.

    7. He'll give his partners infections (yeast, bacterial, etc.)

    8. Circumcision is The Right Thing To Do.

    9. EWWW!! That's so GROSS!!

    I could list more. Mostly my responses are either along the lines of "mind your own fucking business" or, if I'm feeling rather gernerous, I'll try to explain why most of these are bullshit. I spend a lot of time having to defend myself for the decision I made, and I hate it.

    However, I am not a man and though I've heard most of these are bullshit, what can you guys tell me about your REAL experiences regarding these common perceptions?

    I live in the US, so most adult men are cut, unlike almost everywhere else. I've read, however, that the rate of routine circumcisions is going down these days. Anyway, I was hoping that men, both cut and uncut, and women can give me their personal take on these perceptions and if I can stop worrying now. Also, any creative responses when these fucking people start to bitch at me. For some reason, "none of your business" doesn't seem to deter some people.

    Thanks!

    Snooz
     
  2. Sergeant_Torpedo

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    I am cut in a society where males remain intackt but it is also a well educated and civilized society so for anyone to question an issue such as this would be thought downright rude in the least and mildly fascist in the extreme. Those criticizing you and your partner are zealots and pretty ignorant ones that that.
    The un cut penis is clean and healthy as a cut one. The only grounds for debate are aesthetic ones and his future sexual partners are not going to give cut or uncut a high degree of thought. You are doing your son a disservice if you don't dismiss these peoeple now. There interest in this personal area of your life is unacceptable and frankly perverse. If they are being coercive in this area of your family life then they are dangerous. Would you give them leave to discuss your bank account or political affiliations. No. So politely dismiss them and ask them bluntly why they are so interested in your child's sexual organs.
     
  3. carlton10

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  4. chris2026

    chris2026 New Member

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    Fancy believing any of those complaints! Being Americans, they really need to get out and experience the rest of the world more. (The ridiculously low proportion of you Americans who hold passports is something that makes the rest of the world shudder whenever Americans lecture us about things in our countries - how on earth would many of you know what life is like beyond your own shores?)

    Still, given that these fools need to justify their own unnecessarily mutilated genitals, or having unnecessarily mutilated their sons', it isn't surprising that an intact penis makes them confront their own stupidity.

    No one ever died from their penis having been left intact. Pity those poor kids who have died because some fool thought cutting them up was a good idea.
     
  5. carlton10

    carlton10 Member

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    I am uncut and back in my day as a boy. not many were and I have to admit I did get teased for that and the endowment but nowadays more parents seem to let there sons be uncut in the USA -so he probably wont be teased-and any sexual partner I have had has had no problem whatsoever with me being uncut and in fact has been a turn on to them- I am now so thankful my parents left me intact and I wouldnt have it any other way and if I ever had had a son I would have let him intact too-You didnt mention if ur husband was cut or uncut- what thoughts or experiences went through his mind as part of ur decison ?
     
  6. snoozan

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    Thanks for your input. Even though you did get teased (and what kid doesn't?) it seems like you came out okay from it anyway. I think you're right though, it's beginning to even up on circumcised vs. uncircumcised. It's good to hear you're happy with yourself-- I'm hoping my son feels the same way as an adult.

    My husband is neither cut nor uncut from a series of surgeries related to a birth defect. In fact, most of his concerns were based around the boy looking "normal" (since he perceives he does not as a result of the surgeries), but I think he got it that "normal" doesn't equal circumcised. The other thing was that by the time I had been sick my whole pregnancy, on bed rest, my dad died, almost gave birth 1000 miles from home, long labor and then an emergency c-section, neither of us wanted to put him or us through anything else.



    Thank you.

    It's good to see that there are other moms out there that think like me. Ethically, I felt the same way-- it's not my choice to make about his body.

    I also love uncut cocks. I love cut cocks. A beautiful cock is a beautiful cock no matter if it's cut or not. I don't really have a preference myself, but I know women that do. However, in most cases, it's because they've rarely or never seen an uncut penis.

    Good point on the bullying issue. "Why are you looking at my junk?" might be just the thing to shut up any would-be bully.

    I agree 100% with everything you said and that made me feel a lot better. I think for me it might just be learning to deal with the shitheads in my life that feel the need to insert their opinion at every chance they get. I've been thinking about this a lot because a friend that is overly critical and very opinionated has been the latest (yesterday) to get on me about this.

    Snoozan
     
  7. scanjock8

    scanjock8 Active Member

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    wow, it's hard to believe people could be so openly rude--they deserve to be told to fuck off and then some.

    i have to wonder if you live somewhere in the south or midwest. these regions maintain higher rates of circumcision than the rest of the country. in the west, where i live, the rates have dropped dramatically (below 40%)--people here would have a reaction opposite of what you've experienced. choosing not to circumcize was an obvious decision for the couples i know, which seems like the norm.

    when i was a kid, being uncut could have resulted in locker room teasing--but today i think that's a non-issue. all the other reasons you list are either unproven or outdated stereotypes. i'm sure your son will appreciate your decision to leave him intact.
     
  8. anepu

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    It is the first time that I participate in this forum, but before such facts,

    I am obliged to pronounce me.

    It is sad that bigger part of the Americans thinks in this way, do not have to know that of this side of the Atlantic, in the old Europe, it's the the opposite.

    The percentage of cut mens is very little.

    None does not exist problem.

    More value to make questions of geography!

    From Portugal. Regards
     
  9. DC_DEEP

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    Snoozan, thank you for reserving that choice for your son. I'm the third of three sons. My mom was a little naive, and my dad was cut, so when the doctor suggested circumcising my oldest brother, my parents agreed. When mom saw what was involved, she refused to allow her next two sons to be trimmed. I'm glad she did.

    I only had to do the "locker-room" thing for one year in public school, when I was in sixth grade. It was slightly embarrassing at first, when I realized that most of the boys were cut, but not one single time did anyone make comments. I'm guessing that they didn't want to be "caught looking at my stuff."

    When I was in high school, and still experimenting sexually, a woman who was a close friend and sex partner for several years (but not a "girlfriend") commented that mine was the first "natural" cock she had seen, and that it looked more normal to her than the altered ones, they just looked somehow "incomplete."

    Regarding the "boys can't be taught to keep anything clean" comments, the proper response is "Really? Should I have all his baby teeth, and then his permanent teeth pulled, since I won't be able to teach him how to keep his teeth clean?"

    I don't have cancer, and I have never given a partner, male or female, any kind of infection. Maybe that's because I wash my cock every time I shower.

    Stand your ground, and don't let your "pro-body-modification-on-children" friends put a guilt trip on you. I promise, your son won't hate you when he grows up, for letting him make irreversible decisions for himself. And uncut men have been having sex, getting married, and having children of their own for several thousands of years, your son won't be the exception.
     
  10. fortiesfun

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    I'm a cut male, but chose not to have my son cut. I took endless shit for it from friends and family for about a year, then it quit being a topic of discussion. He is now in his twenties and all is well. It was never an issue again. He is happy and healthy. Hang in there. In short order it will all dry up and blow away.
     
  11. avalonjim

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    Ignorance, stupidity, and I think its time for you to tell these people to fuck off. According to my mother I was circumcised. I have no idea what she is talking about, because I have always had a foreskin (I am looking at mine right now) My sister went thru the same arguments with me about this when she had her son circumcised. Because his dad was, was her final argument.

    Now here is my personal take on circ'ing a kid. Don't do it.

    As to the ideas that he will be teased, wanna know what was said to me? "hey.... Jimmy has a snake in a sweater!! Cool, how did that happen" I genuinely had no idea that circumcision was as prevelant as it is in the US as a kid. I assumed (incorrectly) that the only people circumcised were the Jewish kids and adults I knew from the Y. Because my family is still pretty Ethnic ( My dad did not come to the US until 1951 from Austria) All the peckers I saw were not cut. I thought that cut meant Jewish or Muslim.

    Here is how hard it is to help your son. Show him how to pull the skin back, wash with soap, rinse, snap the skin back and dry off. Not that hard.

    Where are you from that this is the perception of a healthy penis?

    Good luck, Its not that hard, and tell these people to blow it out their ass. That kind of attitude embodies EVERYTHING I hate about America. Ignorance, stupidity, fear, and lack of acceptance.
     
  12. dolfette

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    good for you!
    i'm glad you did what you thought was right, instead of what your society tries to push on you.
     
  13. B_dickman27

    B_dickman27 New Member

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    i dont get that thing with cut and uncut dicks? Can i ask one question ..why do u cut ur dicks? is it a religious matter? is it a medical matter? Where i come from its not a matter at all. Only guys with fimosis have cut cocks.
     
  14. Kjartan

    Kjartan New Member

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    The only remark that people you know have made that comes anywhere near a truth is that he might have to get circumcise later. Some men are born with foreskin that is too tight, the frenulum might be too short or even in some cases both. These are issues that can usually be fixed without circumcision. I was born with both of these defects and when faced with the third corrective surgery I decided to have the foreskin completely removed, but that was my own decision as an adult.

    People who think this hurts more as a grown up than as an infant are clearly delusional, since the nervous system has not had a few years of abrasions to numb the sensitivity a bit and so infants are more sensitive to all touch. Also infants can not be anesticed as adults can and may probably not be prescribed strong pain killers to numb the pain in the following days. So as a person who had to have this done I'm very glad that it was my decision.

    So if you really need to explain yourself you could ask these people in return if they would themselves want to have surgery without anestetics, my guess is that most would not like that one bit, so why do they presume that its ok for infants.
     
  15. Rubenesque

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    I commend those of you who have made the decision not to put your sons through an unnecessary medical procedure just for the sake of 'aesthetics'.

    I'm so pleased I live in a country where, generally, it isn't considered unless absolutely necessary.

    I'm stunned at the comments you have received Snoozan, I had no idea that there were still people THAT stupid in the world!!

    Living where I do, and circumcision being relatively rare, only 2 of my ex lovers have been cut. And as yet, I have never had a yeast or bacterial infection, none have developed foreskin related cancer (that is the comment that shocked me most), none hate their mothers for not butchering them and all have had nice clean penises. As for being made fun of by other kids - if it's not the foreskin it'll be something else, kids are cruel and will always find a reason to make fun of each other.
     
  16. DC_DEEP

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    Well, none of the reasons that your friends give for harrassing you are valid, but the two most common (and also the two most idiotic and asinine) reasons are "make him look like dad" and "it's more hygienic, boys can't learn to keep it clean." It amazes me that anyone would use either of those excuses. For the first, would they consider ANY OTHER permanent body modifications to make a son look more like his father? Tattoos and piercings at age one month, to look more like dad? Cut off fingers or toes or arms or legs to match the ones dad lost in an accident? Bleach or dye the child's skin, or get him a nose job if he is bi-racial? Wow. It's easier to cut off a piece of his penis, than to give a simple answer to a child's simple question: "Why does my penis look different than daddy's?" "Because when daddy was a baby, the doctor cut off a piece of his penis. We didn't want to do that to you."

    And I addressed the hygiene thing previously in this, and several other, threads: I don't know about any other man, but keeping my teeth clean is much more complicated and time-consuming than keeping my foreskin clean. Flossing and brushing takes 4 times as long and requires a lot more dexterity and maneuvering than pulling back the skin, soaping up, and rinsing.
     
  17. Dave NoCal

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    First, you and your husband are to be commended for respecting you son's right to his own body. In my opinion, the state and federal laws prohibiting genital mutilation of girls shoud be made gender neutral. You can read more about that at mgm.org.

    I agree with the other responders that these people you describe are being rude and disrespecting your family boundaries. Arguing with them probably won't help as their actions are surely related to defensiveness about either having been cut, or having had a child cut. Logic is irrelevant.

    If you can't tell them to fuck off, my suggestion is that you firmly and clearly state that this topic is not on the table for discussion.

    Latinos, Asians, and many caucasians in this country do not cut their sons. Yours will be fine.
     
  18. chico8

    chico8 New Member

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    I disagree with those who claim that interest in a child's genitals is perverse, at least in this context. If they look different, of course they're going to comment on them and there's nothing inherently wrong with that. What's perverse is to believe that removing the foreskin is inherently better.

    I'm sure it has been difficult dealing with ignorance and prejudice but routine infant circumcision will never end if people don't talk about it. I feel bad that you're paying such a high price for doing the right thing.

    The reason we have such hangups about sexual issues in this country is because we are discouraged from looking and from talking about what we see. If fathers and mothers were more open with their children about issues like circumcision and the differing sizes of genitalia, puberty, etc. there would be a lot less strife in this country.

    Reading all the posts from young guys and quite a few older ones about how insecure they are about nudity or their genitalia etc., most seem to be Americans. Shame is not a family value.
     
  19. mrdoody

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    here here.
     
  20. B_NineInchCock_160IQ

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    I'm surprised more of the foreskin nazis haven't chimed in yet, so far I only see Chico. Anyway, though I can understand some of those points others have raised to you, ultimately, even the points that are valid (many weren't) it's none of their damn business. Why are you even discussing your son's circumcision status with other people in the first place? That was a decision you and your child's father made and doesn't concern anyone besides you two and your son.
    While it's true that some think of uncircumcised penises as ugly/unclean, and it's also true that in this country uncircumcised penises have traditionally been and still are in the minority- and therefore a potential object of scorn among children since children are notoriously ept at picking out differences and belittling others for them... take comfort in the fact that this is changing. Circumcisions are increasingly rare in the United States so I doubt your son is going to be affected much by your decision and really that's all that matters- not what your nosey neighbors think. Plus, as I'm sure others have pointed out, there's no strong evidence linking non-circumcision to any serious health risks.
     
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