Unions better wake up

Discussion in 'Politics' started by B_starinvestor, Dec 4, 2008.

  1. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    Boeing Considers Delaying Dreamliner Deliveries - WSJ.com

    c'mon unions. Please start making concessions or we are going straight into super deep dodo.

    Ford's CEO even conceded that GM and Chrysler are done without a gov't bailout/rescue. And done possibly in the next 45 days.

    This isn't the time for union posturing.
     
  2. nudeyorker

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    Could not agree with you more...but good luck with that. Most of the business's bleeding to death are doing so largely because of unions.
     
  3. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    The United Auto Workers union Wednesday offered two major concessions to the Big Three auto makers

    So, the message is being received
     
  4. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    It is being received, but the concessions are laughable

    UAW agrees to Concessions With Automakers - TIME.

    They couldn't put a nickel into VEBA regardless of an agreement by the union to delay contributions for a year.

    Also, contract 'modifications' are politics and PR bullshit. The UAW will need to consider 40-50% wage cuts just to entertain the possibility of survival. Honestly, VEBA delays are so ridiculous....its like saying 'we won't make you give us a raise this year."
     
  5. justine

    justine Member

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    Not only the unions but our government Senators, Congress, Liagacy cost for the retired employees. What gives the government employees the right to continue to recieve their benefits and wages. Why should they not be adjusted to help curb the many problems we are facing. Why should we continue to pay large retirements to self made millions who were our presidents. Why are we not cutting the cost of the government drivers for these people, air fare, many many other areas. Let us not blame the auto workers as lazy money grabbing pigs. Let us look to our leaders for guidance and they should show us how to adjust to these problems.
     
  6. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    I'll probably get flogged and stoned for this, but this is a major contributor to jobs going overseas as well.

    Unions were important at one time to protect certain rights, but its created a situation in which companies/industries with unions are at a competitive disadvantage and simply can not survive.

    For the UAW, I would think that less pay and less benefits would be better than no pay and no benefits - which is the likely scenario.
     
  7. tripod

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    If I was in a union... I would rather take a cut then lose my job as a result of the business dying. The negotiations aren't done yet right? Maybe they will make some more before it is all done?
     
  8. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    That's my point.

    Its highly unlikely they will agree to pay cuts. We'll see. It will be a disaster if they go under.
     
  9. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    can't imagine they would be that short-sighted, given the rising unemployment
     
  10. devron

    devron New Member

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    They're gambling.

    Who here really thinks the government isn't going to cave and bail them out?
     
  11. curious n str8

    curious n str8 New Member

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    Well said!!! :grinning-smiley-003 Now we just need to Get word to our Congress members
     
  12. Notaguru2

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    2 threads of yours I agree with in the same day? =) We won't be bailing out the AAU. The union has held these organizations for ransom and crippled our competitiveness. NO BAIL OUT. NO LOAN. File Chapter 11 like every other business when they make bad decisions; they'll be stronger for it.
     
  13. faceking

    faceking Well-Known Member

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  14. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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  15. transformer_99

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    F*ck them all, Boeing, Ford, GM and Chrysler ! I own a Nissan ! They have $ 1.5 trillion to bail this mess out and guess what, those of us that were priced out & screwed over the last 8 years have nothing to show for it.

    At first auto execs showed up in Washington DC in private jets. The next time they drove their company's products to DC. Must be really rough/tough in a recession, having such a difficult time choosing what they're going to show up to beg for their bailout in. Whether it be a brand new hybrid or a private plane and limo ? Why don't they go down to the "buy here, pay here" lot and drive a 10 year old vehicle that's been wrecked a few times and priced @ $ 5,000. Maybe default on their mortgages on those mansion(s) they live in and go live in a leaky run-down apartment ? These execs are still going to layoff those workers, what profits their companies made have been squandered on their incomes and lifestyles and what it takes to maintain that. Anything they get as a bailout will bail them out first and the last people to get any redemption/salvation will be the auto workers. Want to see a smaller scale of this mess, just revisit the airline industry following 9/11/2001.

    Bush urges airline bailout | CLTV.com | Chicagoland's Television

    US airlines follow bankruptcy filings with mass layoffs

    Facts are facts, approximately 4 years later, after a bailout, this is what happened. So what are we really buying here with any of these bailouts ?
     
  16. transformer_99

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    Nice chart, so how come anyone can go to a dealership and pay just as much or more for a Nissan, Honda, or Toyota than what they can for a Ford, Chevy or Chrysler product ? Looks to me like the non-UAW workers are being low balled for higher profit margins ? And it all works out in the end, the service industry gets low balled into poverty just the same. Far more labor in other industries than the UAW auto industry. I mean, if we don't feel sorry for CEO's and MBA management getting obscene paychecks and compensation packages, how terrible it must be that the labor that actually makes those products get their cut of it ?
     
  17. B_starinvestor

    B_starinvestor New Member

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    You can't. For similar products, the Toyotas and Hondas are $2K less.


    They [non-UAW workers] are receiving fair wages, and the consumers are getting fair prices on good products.

    What? The imports have far greater warranties. Possibly I don't understand your statement.

    I'm with you here. CEO's, execs are way, way overpaid.
     
  18. transformer_99

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    Honda Civic Family - 2009 - the Official Honda Web Site
    2009 Honda Civic Coupe - the Official Honda Web site

    Honda Civic Coupe $ 15,205 4 door $ 15,405 to NGV $ 25,090

    Sedan - 2009 Ford Focus (Sync)

    Ford Focus $ 14,995 to $ 17,970

    Upgrade that to a Fusion ?

    Sedan - 2009 Ford Fusion (Sync)

    $ 19.035 to $ 23,755

    I'll give you that what the Honda may be as a perceived upgrade beyond the Focus, the Fusion will get you more vehicle than the Civic for what most are after spending in that target market. The Honda is the wiser buy vs the Focus, but the Fusion is a more luxurious upgrade and costs about the same. That's just Ford vs Honda.
     
  19. faceking

    faceking Well-Known Member

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    I can get a BMW cheaper than a Toyota ... so what's your point?

    Your qualitative analysis is riddled with folly... just riddled and overwraught with folly.
     
  20. transformer_99

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    Now this I'd like to see, I'm talking about walking up and comparing sticker prices on the lot for comparable class/sized vehicles.
     
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