USA Homeland Security Card

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by Freddie53, May 6, 2005.

  1. Freddie53

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    Listening to the ABC news last night. Haven't checked it out in print media yet. But, the US Congress is considering a bill that would require EVERYONE to have a Universal Card. You would need your Social Security card and three other kinds of identification to get it and it would take several days to get.

    Homeland Security would have a data base on every citizen with every piece of information about you. Address, phone and personal business items. This way Homeland Security can monitor each person that is inside the USA to see if that person is invovled in terrorist activities.

    It will also mean that should anyone get a hold of the info on your data bank, they would know EVERYTHING about you.

    Americans in particular, but others as well, how do you feel about the US Government now having every bit of information about you in one computer file in the possesion of an agency that's purpose is to weed out POTENTIAL terrorists.

    Who is a POTENTIAL terrorist?

    How does that stack up to freedoms in the Bill of Rights?

    This is what Hitler did. Require a universal card for all to carry.

    Sounds very dangerous to me. Does this bother anyone else besides me?

    What do you think?
     
  2. db03

    db03 Member

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    America has become paraniod about terrorism, I think the card is a good idea, the Spanish use something similar, but the US government is using the "fear factor" in all of the decisions it makes, all in the name of a "safer world"
     
  3. KinkGuy

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    Yeah, I really want the same company who counted the votes or is so successful keeping your credit record, running a database with all of our PERSONAL information in it. The ever efficient neo-con government management is planning on farming this work out as well to a big corporate donor.

    Golly, I want everything about my life entered into the database by that really efficient person at the Dept of Motor Vehicles! Then, when there is an error and I wind up in some detention center because I'm on a "watch list" at the airport, I'll get to call some really friendly person in India to resolve the problem.

    WHAT THE FUCK HAPPENED TO THE CONSTITUTION !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    oh that's right, we don't use it anymore. it's not good for business.

    The funding for the "national I.D. card" was buried in the Iraq war 82 billion dollar "supplemental" funding bill, which passed last week with no debate and wasn't even read by the majority of the house OR senate.
     
  4. Dr Rock

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    who lives in the east 'neath the willow tree? Sex
    compulsory citizen IDs are traditionally one of the hallmarks of the "surveillance state." and here's another cold war soundbite for you: "stampede legislation" (meaning restrictive and/or repressive acts steamrollered into law through justification by real or fictitious security threats - the claim is always "the people's best interests", although predictably the "people" themselves are never actually consulted). we've seen this cycle in almost constant, rapid motion in the US and UK since 2001. it is a distressingly textbook example of elective dictatorships (or as we like to call them here in our wacky western nations, "democracies") taking advantage of a dependent populace to permanently legitimize their own abuses of authority.

    in other words: think about it. do you REALLY trust these fuckers with ANY sort of power, let alone the power to reach out and literally delete your life - in the people's best interests - by tapping a few keys? bear in mind that once this database is up and running, you can't just decide to get rid of it. there'll be a hundred copies in a hundred secure locations, updated every 30 seconds - you get the idea. you really wanna give some government psycho that sort of power over you? you may as well leave a gift-wrapped box of scalpels and sodium pentathol by the front door for when they show up, too.
     
  5. BobLeeSwagger

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    On a purely practical level, I don't see how it would help security. It could be forged just like passports and social security cards can. And the federal government can already find out almost all information about you if it really wants to. It sounds like a ploy to make it seem like they're doing something to secure the country. You know, like creating a Department of Homeland Security in the first place.
     
  6. yaoifun

    yaoifun New Member

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    I'd rather kiss a toilet seat. The card is ok, but sone things are better left private. They don't understand some things just are NOT their business and most people do NOT pose a threat. Hearts in the right place, but it is nothing more than utter paranoia.
     
  7. Lex

    Lex
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    Call me a cynic, but I assume that they have access to all that info already. I take these measures as their efforts to centralize accessibility (I am NOT saying that I agree). I have never thought that I have true privacy and simply try no to do anything SO deviant as to alert the authorities.
     
  8. madame_zora

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    Well, I got advance notice of this several years ago. I worked for a company that sells credit card processors and during the time that the "smart cards" were being developed, like the Amex blue card, we were informed of the long term possibilities of the information the card could hold. Of course, it is being used in some countries now as a means of credit and identification, I have no doubt the US and UK will fall in line in the name of "progress", but I will do everything in my power to avoid it for as long as possible.

    I'd rather live in a third world country than trust these corrupt bastards with my identity, and it may come to that yet. The world of credit is scary enough, I'll be damned if I want the government AND the small elite group of credit processors working together on this. Did you know that basically five or six families started every major credit card company, and still retain control of them? The group is so small they actually all know each other and hang out in California together. A real eye-opener. Credit cards as we know them have only been around since the late seventies/early eighties, a lot has changed about how we view money in a short time. Just try to imagine how much a computer-coded identity card will influence our lives.
     
  9. Pecker

    Pecker Retired Moderator
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    Do you mean to say that, after this takes effect, cops will no longer stop drivers, druggies, johns or drunks only to find that they have no i.d.'s with them?

    Yeah, right.

    Somewhere deep within that law will be a clause spelling out the penalty for not having the card with you at all times.

    Can subcutaneous chips be far behind?
     
  10. madame_zora

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    That's exactly what I'm afraid of. I'm pretty sure the technology for this is already in existance. Wonder how the weather is in Ecuador?
     
  11. Onslow

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    Odd that you should mention Ecuador since at this very moment Junior is circumventing the NAFTA stuff and has a crew starting operations down in Quito making Jebbers as he calls them, in honor of his brother who he plans to help make next President of the United Skates, er, I mean STATES. . What they are in essence is, microchips which will be placed in the palm of your hand which will start to glow red when you turn 30... no wait that was Logan's Run the comedy movie from the 1970's (look it was so over the top I can only think of it as a comedy, although the theory behind it was frightening).
    I have an uneasy feeling the first guinea pigs of this technology are already in place. Perhaps some of the recent alleged terrorism detainees at Guntanamo have been outfitted with them. Or maybe it's every soldier being sent to Afghanistan and Iraq.

    Ecuadorian Weather

    Although I would beg you to reconsider leaving since the time variable and internet connections there may not allow LPSG and we cannot live without you here.
     
  12. db03

    db03 Member

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    If all americans will need to carry a card with them at all times, then what about foreign visitors??

    Do we need to be on a leash at all times in case we decide we want to go and commit some terrorism??
     
  13. SpeedoGuy

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    Well, all foreign visitors are already required to be fingerprinted on arrival in the US. I'm sure that information is all going into some database.

    I'm not in favor of some kind of national ID card. As aloofman pointed out, the feds already have much of this info and it probably won't make the nation any more secure because ID can be faked. ID cards will, howevever, make it easier for unscrupulous credit companies and government agencies to do much mischief with our personal information.

    SG
     
  14. db03

    db03 Member

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    Ya i remember getting fingerprinted...its kinda insulting but I think in today's world its a necessary evil.

    The guy that did it was really rude too...
     
  15. willie

    willie New Member

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    I wouldn't worry about that. With the current hostile attitude of the US immigration officers, people just won't want to visit the States.

    They never were exactly friendly, but being now I prefer to spend my holidays in countries where I'm not treated like a suspect.
     
  16. Dr Rock

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    who lives in the east 'neath the willow tree? Sex

    that's basically it - it's a means of streamlining control mechanisms that are already in place. it basically means any government department wishing to put the screws on you will be able to do it in 5 minutes in their own office, rather than wait days or weeks for their request to be processed by another. it also means they can be sure all the information they have is 100% reliable at all times. :puke:

    <!--QuoteBegin-db03
    @May 7 2005, 03:08 PM
    I think in today&#39;s world its a necessary evil.
    [post=308891]Quoted post[/post]​
    [/quote]
    so we&#39;re constantly told. in my experience there&#39;s already enough wholly UNnecessary evil in the world without deliberately adding to it.
     
  17. madame_zora

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    Yeah, I must say I&#39;ve been treated far better when travelling abroad than we treat visitors here. There&#39;s just gotta be someplace less stupid than this&#33;

    Onslow, thanks for the weather report and the vote of encouragement. You can rest assured that I&#39;ll need an internet connection wherever I land, so if not Ecuador then help me find the land of the less stupid&#33; I now appoint you secretary of travel.

    Dr. Rock, no more E-vil? I was kinda hoping we&#39;d just pile it on, it will help facilitate our untimely collapse.
     
  18. blackwood

    blackwood New Member

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    I have been looking into the gringo colony at Lake Chapalla, Mexico. Non Mexicans have settled this area in retirement for 30 years or so and I guess if you can get across the border, and do a quick 12 hour car trip your safe.


    ?? scares me most, my retirement annuities are basical federal funded and controled by the likes currently demeaning the country.(edit info))
    Very little hassel

    b..........
     
  19. jonb

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    Yeah, but for the most part, a lot of offices are disagreeing with the Bush administration. So some small businesses shred their records save for any outstanding debts every fiscal year. And many libraries shred their records except for any library books not yet due regularly. And more and more anti-scumware amateurs are taking aim at government spyware in particular. And the LAPD doesn&#39;t enforce Bush&#39;s "arrest all illegals" rule because illegals are worth more as informants.
     
  20. Dr Rock

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    who lives in the east &#039;neath the willow tree? Sex
    most of the big city police police depts don&#39;t bother to arrest illegals, with the obvious exception of those making a public nuisance of themselves. the fact is that the police have always known that "initiative" to be a colossal waste of time and resources, even since it was first put forward back in (I think) the 20s. it remains the case that the vast majority of illegal immigrants (understandably) prefer not to do anything to draw attention to themselves and are thus overall LESS likely as a demographic to commit HARMFUL crimes than "natives." the majority of illegal immigrants who are criminals are illegal immigrants BECAUSE they were already criminals. there&#39;s also the fact that illegals will take low-wage under-the-table work, which (while it may be morally ambiguous) encourages business owners - who typically have the largest representation in local government - to turn a blind eye.
     
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