What do you know about the Masons?

madame_zora

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JustAsking said:
Spooge, thanks and yes, they are not the same guys. I meant to say that the original Knights Templar were truly old, whereas the Freemasons are only a recently formed organization. The modern day Templars, Rosicrucians, Illuminatti, etc, are not really direct lineages back to the original groups.

I don't really believe the original Templars formed the Freemasons, but the conspiracy theories about that are really interesting. The crux of it is that the remaining vanquished Templars formed the Freemasons in order to bring in a secular Enlightenment world order so as to get revenge on the Catholic church that betrayed them.

They hid out in the stonemason's guilds and disguised their speculative work in the trappings of the building craft terminology to avoid detection, and they influenced the birth of science and secular humanism. Over time the speculative part overtook the operative part and when the world was sufficiently secular and they had enough political clout, they surfaced in the 1700s and went public. Part of their work was to influence the founding of America as a beacon of the Englightenment.

Its one of the most interesting conspiracy theories, I think. Its a way better story than the DaVinci Code, JFK Assasination conspiracies, or 9/11 missles hitting the Pentagon. I wonder if Tom Hanks will be in the movie?

Not knowing much about it, on the outside it does look plausible considering the time in which their "underground" activities would have been taking place. Are there buildings which would display their symbols still standing from pre 1700s? That could go a long way to determine the truth of when they began, couldn't it?
 

DaveyR

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HickBoy said:
You must be 21 years old.
You must believe in a supreme being.
You must be able to pass a background investigation.

You must ask a Freemason for a petition to join his lodge, then send that petition back to the lodge where it will be given to an investigating committee. If the committee find nothing in your background to prevent you from being admitted, they will present your petition at the next lodge meeting for a vote. If no member or members present object to your joining the lodge, then you're in. All you have to do then is receive three degrees by participating in rituals during which they will be conferred upon you, and do a bit of studying so you can be tested on each of the three degrees.

That's all.

So do you know what they are looking for in the background check? Are they looking for criminal records only? Just interested that's all.
 

B_Stronzo

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DC_DEEP said:
My dad was active (and reached one of the higher degrees) with the Freemasons, and my mom with the OES. I never had any interest.

ditto

One of the old family houses near Cape Ann has a Masonic meeting room contained in the second storey. It's still owned by cousins. There are very interesting paintings on the meeting room walls on the second floor which have never been painted over. They're rather bucolic and the symbols range from a compass in gold leaf to the cedars of Lebanon among other pretty crudely applied motifs. The room, as I recall, always seemed musty and stale as if time stood still there.

It has always been a source of considerable sadness to my father that I would not join Demolay and then seguey into the Masons. Its history patrilineally can be traced back on his side to the 18th century at least. My sister made it as far as Rainbow Girls which I believe is the precursor to OES. My dad was prone to tempt with with the old line "you don't get to know the secrets until you join". Pity he didn't tell me they were giving each other head. Now that possibly could have made me join.:rolleyes:

My grandfather used to go on about only Protestants being able to join. I believe that's changed.


My great grandfather's funeral service (first homage to his death) was a closed-door ceremony held by his Freemason fellows. It was closed to family members as well. He was, I think, what's called a "33rd degree Mason" though I was never interested enough to find out what it signified. My father's showne me a pin that signified that rank. I recall (since I was very young) being a bit spooked by all the laurel branches - if that's what they were - around his head as he lay there in his coffin with his ancient face and starched white shirt and tie.


Paul Revere's great grandson began the local order where I was raised (honest DC I'm not inventing it) and the early meetings were held in his wonderful old house (now a private residence) before the Freemason's built the present temple in the center of town.


Great topic. Time to demythologize it and give it some perspective.
 

JustAsking

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Mme. Zora,
Yes, thats a good question. Again, I don't have a strong belief in the conspiracy theories that trace the lineage way back to the Templars, but I am thoroughly entertained by them. I don't mean they are ridiculous, I mean they read like a much better thriller than the DaVinci Code. And they share with the Code the fact that the theory is based on hundreds of true things that probably do not all add up to the big claim, but it makes it really interesting.

As for buildings, there is tons of books and articles (all very controversial) on the architecture and layout of Washington DC. But that is in the 1700s and not what you were asking.

As for pre-1700s, there is a lot of interesting stuff from the 1600s because the Freemasons were a kind of underground organization at that time. There was even a time between the 1600s activity and the big "coming out" in the 1700s when the Masons were illegal. The really interesting thing is that during the 1600s, it looks like the founding members of the Royal Society in England were also an underground Masonic Lodge (this is controversial, of course). Why this is interesting is that the Royal Society was also a kind of underground organization because it was the formal beginning of the secular Enlightenment approach to the study of nature in a big way (this part is very true). Newton, Boyle, Lodge, Ward, and the great London architect Christopher Wren, and others were meeting in each other's homes forging the beginning of formalized empiricism.

This kind of activity was somewhat subversive but only in a cultural / religious way, not a political one. It would be popular opposition that would cause them to keep quiet about the fact that they were changing the rules in Natural Science by introducing mathematics, logic, and methodology at the expense of religion. So they laid low and did this until they gained enough political support to go public. At some point the Royal Society became chartered by the government and institutionalized science was born. By Darwin's time (mid 1800s), the Enlightenment was already in full swing and The Royal Society was one of England's crown jewels.

This might not sound that exciting, but it was one of the most amazing times in history, I think. Certainly, in some sense a new world order was being ushered in. So this is part of the "true" stuff.

So now, if you imagine that Templars who were still (hundreds of years after the fact) plotting revenge on the Catholic Church for its betrayal, you could easily imagine that the Royal Society could be part of their strategy. I doubt it highly, but if it were true, then it would have been a genius of a strategy. In terms of a lock on the intellectual world, The Enlightenment would flourish at the expense of the Catholic Church.

The other aspect of the strategy would be influencing the formation of the United States so as to create the perfect environment for Enlightenment ideals to flourish, protected from religion by the Constitution. It is true that most of the signers of the Constitution were Masons and that most of first 15 Presidents were Masons. The theory is aided and abetted by the wierd architecture and the seeming presence of Masonic symbology associated with our money and elsewhere.

Anyway, I don't wear a tin-foil hat about this. I just think it is the coolest conspiracy theory going. Even if it is not true, it is really full of genius.

So I guess the next question is "What about before the 1600s? Is there any architectural evidence that suggests the Masons existed before 1650 or so?", right?

I think there are a number of books around about that claiming all kinds of Masonic stuff on buildings that are much older than the 1600s, but I think these are highly controversial. But I am betting they are really fascinating. You could probably find them as easily as I could with Google and Amazon. I don't have any opinions or insight into which one's might have some valid stuff in them.
 

JustAsking

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Stronzo,
Big time Freemasonry in my family ended with my Grandfather on my mother's side. He was a Grand Master of a number of lodges. I think he was a 32nd degree Mason and I think thats the highest you can go without going to Scotland, but I know that only through family conversations. I could be completely full of crap on that one. But I do know that the 33rd degree is incredibly rare. If your great-grandfather was that, then he was an amazing guy by Freemasonry standards.

My father was your typical 3rd degree guy, which I think you can get with just a few cereal boxtops (j/k). Like a lot of people, he got that right off and didnt attend many meetings after that. I think people did that just so they could get the cool ring which would help them be favored in business relationships. There was a very funny Monty Python sketch about that.

I also remember my Grandfather's funeral. I don't know if there was a "closed" component to it, but I remember the part at our church. Since he was such a big deal Mason, the funeral procession seemed to go on as far as the eye could see. The only one that compares in my family was my Uncle who died in the line of duty as a fireman.

I don't recall the Ivy, but I do recall the massive amounts of Lillies and the overpowering sweet smell of them. I think I was 10 or 12 when that happened.

That thing about the room in your house is really fascinating. For some reason I can almost see and smell that room.

I hope I am not fanning the flames of conspiracy theories too much here. I am not saying I believe in them, and I don't want my guts sucked out by demons.
 

B_Stronzo

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HickBoy said:
The plants you and Stronzo are referring to are probably acacia. It is special to Masons because it is very durable. In fact, it's almost impossible to kill.

It is a practice of ours to place a sprig of acacia in the caskets with the remains of our Masonic brothers.

Thanks HickBoy. I wouldn't have known. Whatever it was it was deep deep green... like the color of holly leaves.

His was the last funeral held in the front room of his old house though the place is still family held.

It seems to me (though the recollection calls very far back in my mind's eye) that only once the door had opened to the front parlor of that old house were we allowed (as a family) to enter. Just prior to that I distinctly recall lines of ancient men (wearing caps [?] or at the very least some sort of ribbon with pendant hanging around their necks) filing out of that room. There was some sort or recitation that took a goodly amount of time too.. My mum was impatient at one point since she's not given to ritual per se.

The feel with which I was left was that it was very insular and secret.

When the family entered the room and my mum walked me over to see my gr. grandfather I remember that it seemed his face was surrounded by this greenery. It was only slightly spooky but really more fascinating. I remember hands under my armpits to lift me to see him straight-on since I wasn't quite tall enough and I'd complained I couldn't see him.

I never asked for a full explanation of what I'd seen. I'll ask my dad one day soon since he'd be most likely to fill me in accurately. And perhaps the rituals vary slightly from one area of the country to another. My sister has our gr. grandfather's Masonic tall clock. It's an amazing thing. The face is brass and the case is mahogany. This brass face is covered in Masonic symbols. I wish I'd opted for the thing when it was offered to both of us but the ceilings in this house wouldn't take the height of it.

Thanks JustAsking for your input too.

The room I spoke of in my previous post is in a cousin's house. I haven't visited it since about 1995 or so. But it was still just as I remembered it from childhood then. And I know the local historical people are aware of it so I suspect it'll get preserved somehow. What stands out in memory most is the battery of cedars so deep green and stylistically intense. Though not much detailed they predominate the scenes on all four walls. The only interruptions are the window and door openings.

And I'm sure you're right about the degree thing. The 33rd thing may be easily off. But I'll see if I can get that pin given to me. I'll ask my dad next time we speak. I know when my gr. grandfather earned that "degree" well into his nineties it was a monstrous event at the local temple. I was very small but I recall how honored he felt and the buzz in the family about how he was being feted. It made me feel proud to be his great grandson. I remember that distinctly since in total my experience with this man had always been loving and tactile and honest. He seemed in a word; genuine.

So the feeling "en famille" was one of completion for his life.
 

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ORCABOMBER said:
Ironically, where I am, it's probably easier to join Al-qaeda.

LOL so funny butu alas probably true.


Stronzo and JA

Thanks for all this information. I know plenty can be got from the internet but IMO getting first hand stories and experiences is much more interesting.
 

JustAsking

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HickBoy said:
The plants you and Stronzo are referring to are probably acacia. It is special to Masons because it is very durable. In fact, it's almost impossible to kill.

It is a practice of ours to place a sprig of acacia in the caskets with the remains of our Masonic brothers.

Woah! Acacia is bigtime symbolism in many religious traditions. Supposedly the Ark of the Covenant was made out of it. I was curious to see what else it might mean to Freemasons and I came up with this:
"To the Mason the symbolic significance of the Acacia has a double aspect, as the tree is the symbol Both of Innocence and of Immortality of the Soul."

Stronzo, that was an amazingly beautiful story. Your writing style has so much thoughtful presence to it.

I agree with whoever said that accounts like this are more interesting than the lore and conspiracy stuff.