What is communication?

[Drifterwood]

I keep hearing people talk about communication. What does it mean? Has it become a platitudinous mantra of those who fear the isolation of being misunderstood?

First, it is not always a good thing. Many organisations use communication to tell you what they want you to hear. It is a one way street and I know people who also think that this is communication. It is not.

I also know people who use communication to control (as above). I can think of one guy I know who has been lead to buy into this communication abuse and his partner now effectively controls him completely through it. I stopped some time ago discussing anything with him, because he just goes back and discusses it with Hitlerina.

Is it just me, or can I expect people who know me to understand what I may think of something without having to disect everything verbally? People who know me, know what I think usually, and can understand many other forms of non verbal communication. If you need me to always communicate verbally, you don't know me, so what are we doing in this relationship. Maybe this is why I always detested the lead character in Sex in the City. Yabber yabber yabber self indulgent egocentric meaningless horse manure.

That is what this rant is about, you can commune without verbal communication, some of us prefer that some or more of the time. I feel that some bully others into their chosen and now expected method of communication.

Communication fascists. :biggrin1:

 

[2322]

Communication is a woman thinking of or telling a man, verbally or telepathically, what to do and then he does it. Any other result means the man is not communicating.

:biggrin: uttahere:

 

[Principessa]

Communication is the process of transfer information from one person to another person.Communication is commonly defined as "the imparting or interchange of thoughts, opinions, or information by speech, writing, or signs...",[1], 1: an act or instance of transmitting and 3 a: "a process by which information is exchanged between individuals through a common system of symbols, signs, or behavior ... also: exchange of information".[2] Communication can be perceived as a two-way process in which there is an exchange and progression of thoughts, feelings or ideas towards a mutually accepted[clarification needed] goal or direction.

I have a good friend with whom I have always been able to communicate via a series of grunts, sighs, and odd noises. Our parents and friends think it's funny. However, his lovers are never amused. :frown1: I think they feel threatened by the level of intimacy that we have to be able to communicate without words. It's not my fault we've been friends since the 2nd grade and often know what the other is thinking. Although I didn't know it until he told me in his 20's, my friend knew he was gay in the 6th grade so it's not like we ever dated or had sex. He's just my best buddy.

Is it significant that I have never had a female friend or boyfriend with whom I could do that?

 

[Phil Ayesho]

All men start out a great communicators...
Most end up being non-communicators.

The reason is because they get sick and tired of constantly being in trouble for communicating what they feel...
Because women really only want men to communciate what women think they OUGHT to be communicating.


In that sense, the meaning of the term has been co-opted.
Its does not mean imparting information.

It means saying what women want to hear.


I prefer the term "rapport"

 

[Jovial]

Why is this a women's issue?

I will say that giving compliments makes one feel good because it makes the receiver feel good. By the same token, saying something that upsets someone else makes one feel bad. Thus, many men stop expressing themselves to women. (There's something implicit here.)

 

[Calboner]

What?

 

[D_Kay_Sarah_Sarah]

Communication in some ways is extremly overrated. If i was with a guy, who i wasnt living with and he tried to call and "talk" every single day and tell me everything he did for the day i'd get very annoyed and probably feel claustrophobic in the relationship. However if he does have a issue with me and/or something ive done i do prefer to be told rather then ignored.

 

[got_lost]

My tenpenneth worth....

Communication isn't just 'talking'.

It's 'contact' or a connection.
Communication can be via eye contact, a touch, a squeeze, a laugh, a grunt.

If you know someone well enough it becomes more than words.

But that knowledge of each other has to remain up-to-date so yes, talking has to be done.

Lack of communication can definitely bugger up a relationship.
You can end up living with a stranger, without it.

Phil's response just makes me sad.

All men start out a great communicators...
Most end up being non-communicators.

To be fair, I don't think that all guys do start out as good communicators, but heck, that's just my humble opinion.

The reason is because they get sick and tired of constantly being in trouble for communicating what they feel...
Because women really only want men to communciate what women think they OUGHT to be communicating.

See! Just sad!
The words of a bitter man who can only blame the female of the species.

Some women would like to know what her man is thinking as she is interested in him and often he doesn't share it as easily as she does.
She certainly doesn't want to hear what he thinks she wants to hear.
She would like to understand him more and have him share with her a bit too.

 

[Phil Ayesho]

See! Just sad!
The words of a bitter man who can only blame the female of the species.

Some women would like to know what her man is thinking as she is interested in him and often he doesn't share it as easily as she does.
She certainly doesn't want to hear what he thinks she wants to hear.
She would like to understand him more and have him share with her a bit too.

I am not bitter. I am realistic.
Can you appreciate the irony of how I said women don't really want to hear a man's feelings, and your response is to totally negate and discount my feelings?


YOur reply is a perfect example of how women simply unilaterally determine that anything a man says that they don't like is ACTUALLY the man saying something else, or the result of something that invalidates that man's expression.

Let me ask you... suppose you read what I said and did NOT assume that it was the result of a bitter man's anger toward women? ( I actually am not angry at women)

What if you read it from the perspective of, hmmm, is that how HE sees things? Could it even be possible that I punish the men in my life when they say things I don't like to hear?


I can tell you that every man who loves a woman has had the common experience of saying something they INTENDED to be a compliment, and having their woman figure out a way to interpret it as an insult.

And they will ALL tell you that they leanr fast that their intention does not matter at all to their women... if the woman figures out a way to take it as an insult, then they believe that the man was trying to insult them.


It does not matter how we feel, it does not matter what our objectives are... the women in our lives DETERMINE on their own if we are villians or heros based upon some script they have of what would or would not be the right response.

A script they have no intention of sharing with us.


All I can tell you is that from the age we first start talking to girls, we quickly come to the realization that its a minefield.

And most of us realize that the safest strategy is to not put our foot out by speaking at all.



Now, you can continue to prove my point by dismissing everything I just said as you did before...

Or you can consider how painful it is for us men to want to connect to you... and forever being in trouble for even trying.

 

[ZOS23xy]

People who get immersed in "things" like marathon football viewings or order their lives around specific events are more likely to be non communicate than the person who can feel at ease with his/her life without the use of props.

Part of a larger picture I know.

 

[Drifterwood]

My tenpenneth worth....

Communication isn't just 'talking'.

It's 'contact' or a connection.
Communication can be via eye contact, a touch, a squeeze, a laugh, a grunt.

If you know someone well enough it becomes more than words.

But that knowledge of each other has to remain up-to-date so yes, talking has to be done.

Lack of communication can definitely bugger up a relationship.
You can end up living with a stranger, without it.

I don't think that you and Phil are actually too far apart on this. I suppose that my issue concerns the abuse of verbal communication.

I can relate to what you are both saying. In my experience, the most fundamental communications that I have made have been non verbal, and as such to be then expected to verbalise that, undermines it. If I feel something, I am feeling it, if I am thinking something, I can probably verbalise it. Certainly I get in a bit of a bother if I am asked to say what I am feeling.

 

[SpeedoGuy]

All men start out a great communicators...
Most end up being non-communicators.

The reason is because they get sick and tired of constantly being in trouble for communicating what they feel...

S'truth.

Conform to others' expectations about communication or be made suffer consequences.

So, which tends to be less painful: Keeping it in or pouring it out?

 

[deleted356736]

My tenpenneth worth....

Communication isn't just 'talking'.

It's 'contact' or a connection.
Communication can be via eye contact, a touch, a squeeze, a laugh, a grunt.

If you know someone well enough it becomes more than words.

But that knowledge of each other has to remain up-to-date so yes, talking has to be done.

My two bobs worth from someone who has been happily married for almost 23 years. You're not only on the wrong track, you are in the wrong country! Men don't do non-verbal communication, and if you expect a man to operate as a woman, then you will end up being frustrated and disheartened. Men are men, you see, and we are much more straight-line and to the point with what we think, how we act, what we say and what we do.

Where communication collapses is where women expect men to decipher why their wife / partner / girlfriend has gone quiet because of something said or not said, or done or not done. What we really need is to be told what we did, or didn't do, or said, or didn't say. With that, we can respond appropriately. Without, we don't know and we generally give up and retreat into a state where no matter how hard we try, it's always wrong.

This emphasis on non-verbal communication is peculiar to Anglo women by the way, and most other women are up-front with their communication, which takes away the frustration and ambiguity. My wife is African, from Zimbabwe, and I just love the way that when it's good she smiles, and when it's not good she tells me, and when it's bad she tells me off. Works well for me, and her, and we're still very much in love after 23 years.

So take a lesson from African culture, where women are women, and aren't afraid to tell their men off. Indeed, it's a strong part of their culture, and even tribal chief's got well and truly told off by their wives. Not only Africa, almost all of the non-Anglo rest of the world.

 

[Drifterwood]

Men don't do non-verbal communication,

I definitely do. A smile, a carress, a hug, a look, any small act of tenderness or compassion, sharing moments of joy, ecstasy, sadness, pain, well being etc etc..

Surely you can tell how your wife feels most of the time after 23 years?

 

[deleted356736]

I definitely do. A smile, a carress, a hug, a look, any small act of tenderness or compassion, sharing moments of joy, ecstasy, sadness, pain, well being etc etc..

Surely you can tell how your wife feels most of the time after 23 years?

I have trained myself to be attuned to non-verbal communication, as interacting with people is a large part of my job and career. I facilitate workshops, run training sessions and those sort of things, and for the Anglo women in my audiences I need to be attuned to what they are thinking. Also with my wife, I am certainly attuned to her moods: happy, sad, depressed and so on.

Where non-verbal communication goes too far with Anglo women is not about expecting men recognise a certain type of mood, but to expect men to somehow recognise the underlying condition that caused the mood, and to fix it.

When I facililtate my workshops or run my training sessions, I have found that my wife's form of verbal communication is not unique to Africans. In Australia we now have a larger number of individuals of Asian ancestry living here, and Asian women are more up-front with their communication as well. If they don't understand, they ask. If they need clarification, they ask. With Anglo women in my audience, I have to interpret that a worried frown is either (a) they aren't following me, or (b) their boss shouldn't have sent them to the workshop or course, or (c) they're going through some sort of personal trauma that has nothing to do with my presentation, or (d) something else. If I ask these worried-looking women, I generally get little response to work with. Only later when they complain about me, do I realise it was (a).

At those times I am very glad that I married an African!

 

[Ethyl]

I definitely do. A smile, a carress, a hug, a look, any small act of tenderness or compassion, sharing moments of joy, ecstasy, sadness, pain, well being etc etc..

Surely you can tell how your wife feels most of the time after 23 years?

When I was younger I paid close attention to what people said and little attention to what they did. Now I do exactly the opposite because I learn much more about people when I examine their actions. Some say one thing but do another and in those cases their actions tell you what they're thinking despite what they say.

 

[lucky8]

I understand communication as any transfer of information or meaning from one entity to another. We're always communicating, even when we think we aren't. I took a class called nonverbal communication a couple years back...it was pretty interesting,

The area of men vs women communication is interesting too. My best friend and I can just look at each other and know exactly what each other is thinking in a given situation, and many times he will say something, pretty much word for word, as I am thinking it. Interesting is all that comes to my mind when this happens. On the other side, I've had several girlfriends where I have had to spell everything out for them because apparently, I'm supposed to be paying attention to their nonverbal signals, but they don't have to pay attention to mine, almost like they expect me to be a mind reader. I try not to pay attention to nonverbal signals given by women anymore, unless they are trying to convey that they are upset or horny, partially, because many women I've been with are indecisive and want one thing one second, then an hour later they have changed their mind. Better to not worry about it I've found

 

[kooperfan]

Communication is a woman thinking of or telling a man, verbally or telepathically, what to do and then he does it. Any other result means the man is not communicating.

:biggrin: uttahere:

i laughed so hard at the truth in that.

 

[kooperfan]

The problem isn't in communicating, it's in overinterpretation of the communication.

 

[lucky8]

The problem isn't in communicating, it's in overinterpretation of the communication.

bingo