What would you do?

[Sam1070]

I would have sex. With protection, of course, but I always practice safe sex.

 

[BBB2.5]

I'm so glad to read the replies of those who are not afraid of people living with HIV. It really shows a higher level of human compassion and caring.
To those of you who have stated No or something similar, really do need to educate your selfs more. There is nothing to be afraid of. With the correct precautions your life could have been be improved by that person you just said "No" to .... What if that person was mister or misses right? Ever heard that saying " don't judge a book by it's cover?" I am not dogging you. I just think that in todays society we all should already be well educated about the transmission of HIV. As well as how to protect our selfs from being infected. :wink:
Take a chance and think about how you would feel if you were in the other persons shoes and you had just been turned down.
:tongue:

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

I'm so glad to read the replies of those who are not afraid of people living with HIV. It really shows a higher level of human compassion and caring.
To those of you who have stated No or something similar, really do need to educate your selfs more. There is nothing to be afraid of. With the correct precautions your life could have been be improved by that person you just said "No" to .... What if that person was mister or misses right? Ever heard that saying " don't judge a book by it's cover?" I am not dogging you. I just think that in todays society we all should already be well educated about the transmission of HIV. As well as how to protect our selfs from being infected. :wink:
Take a chance and think about how you would feel if you were in the other persons shoes and you had just been turned down.
:tongue:

Sweetie, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings with my response. I educated myself, was careful and all of the above. When it came down to it, I'd have a panic attack. Every time. You have to put yourself in MY shoes. A Poz person can't expect a Neg person to have sex just because there's a condom involved. I had the frightening experience of having one break when I was screwing a guy whose ex had AIDS. Scared the shit outta me.

I'm in a 5 year relationship anyway so at this point it doesn't matter. Also, I could have easily turned up Poz from my wild party days when I had a few "what the hell" moments sans condom but for some reason it didn't happen.

I answered honestly because I thought you'd respect me more for it. No offense, I have nothing against Poz people as I would have nothing against people with cancer.

 

[BBB2.5]

Sweetie, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings with my response. I educated myself, was careful and all of the above. When it came down to it, I'd have a panic attack. Every time. You have to put yourself in MY shoes. A Poz person can't expect a Neg person to have sex just because there's a condom involved. I had the frightening experience of having one break when I was screwing a guy whose ex had AIDS. Scared the shit outta me.

I'm in a 5 year relationship anyway so at this point it doesn't matter. Also, I could have easily turned up Poz from my wild party days when I had a few "what the hell" moments sans condom but for some reason it didn't happen.

I answered honestly because I thought you'd respect me more for it. No offense, I have nothing against Poz people as I would have nothing against people with cancer.

My feelings were not hurt. Everyone is allowed thier own opinions. I do understand where you are coming from. I am happy to hear that you are in a relationship. As for your scare ... Seems to me you put everyone into that group ...HIV people are off limits. When it comes to sex.
All is cool with me on my end....:biggrin1:
Be Happy and stay healthy.
:tongue:

 

[Lex]

Honesty is always best. Even when it hurts. The truth is what it is: good , bad, or indifferent.

 

[Webster]

Sweetie, I didn't mean to hurt your feelings with my response. I educated myself, was careful and all of the above. When it came down to it, I'd have a panic attack. Every time. You have to put yourself in MY shoes. A Poz person can't expect a Neg person to have sex just because there's a condom involved.

______________________________________________
I have read some of your posts in other threads and I was very impressed with your intelligence. That is why I am very surprised at your ignorance on this subject.

I AM in your shoes because I am HIV negative. My partner is HIV positive.
I know the very few ways that HIV can be transmitted and I know hundreds of ways to have sex that cannot transmit HIV. If you would learn this, you would have no reason for panic.

Your last sentence is absolutely unconscionable! How you can make a pariah out of another human being simply because he happens to have a disease whose transmission is easily avoidable, is beyond my comprehension.

A "Poz" person deserves exactly the same consideration as any "Neg" person.
It's simple human rights.

 

[SomeGuyOverThere]

Personally, I'd hope that would be your response regardless of HIV status.

Yes.

I'm not sex oriented enough to have sex without protection just because "we'd got to that stage". No protection, no sex as far as I'm concerned.

Unless it was my lifelong partner, and we had both been checked.

 

[B_DoubleMeatWhopper]

Your last sentence is absolutely unconscionable! How you can make a pariah out of another human being simply because he happens to have a disease whose transmission is easily avoidable, is beyond my comprehension.

That quote is almost as bad as the following, also posted by you:

Your statements about being open minded and barring HIV positive people from your life are in direct conflict.

How does not having sex with person make someone a pariah? How does not having sex with a person bar him (or her) from one's life? There are many people that I have not had sex with that I do not consider pariahs and that are not barred from my life. Sorcerer is clearly scared of a disease that deserves to be scared of. He has had the experience of having a rubber break while having sex, as have I. That would tend to make one leery of the efficacy of safer sex: it's not always so safe. He answered truthfully, and his answer was based on what could happen.

I can't really answer for myself. I have never had sex with someone whom I knew to be HIV+. I'm sure some of my partners probably were positive, but none ever informed me of the fact; some probably didn't realise it themselves. I honestly don't know what my reaction would be in such a situation. I'm sure I will have to deal with it at some point. This I will say: I have never engaged in anal intercourse without a condom, not once ... even when involved in a long-term relationship. People tell me that I have missed out by never having experienced bareback ass-fucking. That may be, but I don't regret caution.

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

______________________________________________
I have read some of your posts in other threads and I was very impressed with your intelligence. That is why I am very surprised at your ignorance on this subject.

I AM in your shoes because I am HIV negative. My partner is HIV positive.
I know the very few ways that HIV can be transmitted and I know hundreds of ways to have sex that cannot transmit HIV. If you would learn this, you would have no reason for panic.

Your last sentence is absolutely unconscionable! How you can make a pariah out of another human being simply because he happens to have a disease whose transmission is easily avoidable, is beyond my comprehension.

A "Poz" person deserves exactly the same consideration as any "Neg" person.
It's simple human rights.

Let me clarify some things:
1. We're talking about a life threatening, communicable disease. What I meant was that every negative person has the right to decide if they want to be put at risk. No sex is 100% safe. "Safer" is the word we use. I would not discriminate against or even think differently of a person with HIV under any circumstances EXCEPT this. Now you're talking about putting my health at risk. Remember my story about the broken rubber?
2. In my past attempts (and I do mean attempts) to have sex with people with HIV, I have experienced panic attacks. If you've never experienced one, I'll do my best to describe it: shaking, sweating, ears ringing, nausea, sudden migraine and tunnel vision...it's not fun. You're not gonna fuck someone in the midst of a panic attack. I cannot will them away.
3. If I ever end up single again (God Forbid) and I meet someone sensational and end up falling for them and they are positive, will I take the plunge? I'd sure give it a shot. Am I going to put myself in that position (knowing my past reactions) with some random guy (or woman for that matter), no. If I'm gonna take the risk, it's gotta be worth it.

 

[dcwrestlefan]

______________________________________________
I have read some of your posts in other threads and I was very impressed with your intelligence. That is why I am very surprised at your ignorance on this subject.

I AM in your shoes because I am HIV negative. My partner is HIV positive.
I know the very few ways that HIV can be transmitted and I know hundreds of ways to have sex that cannot transmit HIV. If you would learn this, you would have no reason for panic.

Your last sentence is absolutely unconscionable! How you can make a pariah out of another human being simply because he happens to have a disease whose transmission is easily avoidable, is beyond my comprehension.

A "Poz" person deserves exactly the same consideration as any "Neg" person.
It's simple human rights.

i think you are being overly harsh. the person deciding whether or not to engage in sexual activity has the right to choose who he or she wants. we all have preferences, be it age or nationality or intelligence level or religious standing etc. if your last sentence were referring to legal issues, i am with you 100 pct. but you have no right to expect someone to have sex with you no matter what. it has nothing to do with human rights. it is not your right to expect physical affection from someone that does not want to give it.

if a guy told me he had cancer and was going to die in a month, i'd not have sex with him. don't want to risk emotional attachment with someone who's not going to be around in a short period of time. thats a preference. it doesn't make me a bad person, and sorcerer's preference doesn't make him one either imho.

hiv transmission is NOT easily avoidable totally. its easily mitigated. you can reduce the risk to extremely low, but not entirely eliminate it if intercourse or oral activities are involved. some do not want to go down that road. that is their choice.

 

[GoneA]

last year i had about a three week fling with an amazing girl. she was hiv+. i'm sure i had more sex with her than i did with girls i've been in 'long-term' relationships with (heartthrob though i am). we used protection every time and everything went swimmingly. i've been tested since then and i'm still - thankfully - negative.


nevertheless, i completely see Sorcerer's point. hiv is an ominous disease - a sexually transmitted disease. thus, when one is having sexual intercourse with an hiv positive person their emotions are at their highest altitude. i don't think it's a matter of mentally and/or emotionally sequestering these people as it is properly interacting with them so that you both can enjoy a healthy relationship in everyway.


*hands out condoms to lpsg members*

 

[Webster]

That quote is almost as bad as the following, also posted by you:



How does not having sex with person make someone a pariah? How does not having sex with a person bar him (or her) from one's life? There are many people that I have not had sex with that I do not consider pariahs and that are not barred from my life. Sorcerer is clearly scared of a disease that deserves to be scared of. He has had the experience of having a rubber break while having sex, as have I. That would tend to make one leery of the efficacy of safer sex: it's not always so safe. He answered truthfully, and his answer was based on what could happen.

I can't really answer for myself. I have never had sex with someone whom I knew to be HIV+. I'm sure some of my partners probably were positive, but none ever informed me of the fact; some probably didn't realise it themselves. I honestly don't know what my reaction would be in such a situation. I'm sure I will have to deal with it at some point. This I will say: I have never engaged in anal intercourse without a condom, not once ... even when involved in a long-term relationship. People tell me that I have missed out by never having experienced bareback ass-fucking. That may be, but I don't regret caution.

___________________________________________________
If you bother to go back to the beginning of this thread, you will see that BBB2.5 posed the hypothetical scenario thusly, "You were about to have sex with a person who, right at that moment, told you they were HIV+. Would you go through with what you both started?"

Refusing at that point, to have sex with someone whom you obviously found sexually attractive, absolutely labels that person a pariah. (my opinion)

How do you think the HIV+ person feels at that point?
Are HIV+ people supposed to be quarantined on an island somewhere?

Sorcerer is being irrational.

I should have said, "barring someone from having sex with you even though you were obviously sexually attracted to them up to that point" rather than "barring someone from your life".

I think you knew what I meant.

BTW, I am not an advocate of unsafe sex which you seemed to imply in your diatribe.

The bottom line is that if you practice safe sex, there is no reason to worry about becoming infected with HIV. Can we at least agree on that?

 

[Webster]

Let me clarify some things:
1. We're talking about a life threatening, communicable disease. What I meant was that every negative person has the right to decide if they want to be put at risk. No sex is 100% safe. "Safer" is the word we use. I would not discriminate against or even think differently of a person with HIV under any circumstances EXCEPT this. Now you're talking about putting my health at risk. Remember my story about the broken rubber?
2. In my past attempts (and I do mean attempts) to have sex with people with HIV, I have experienced panic attacks. If you've never experienced one, I'll do my best to describe it: shaking, sweating, ears ringing, nausea, sudden migraine and tunnel vision...it's not fun. You're not gonna fuck someone in the midst of a panic attack. I cannot will them away.
3. If I ever end up single again (God Forbid) and I meet someone sensational and end up falling for them and they are positive, will I take the plunge? I'd sure give it a shot. Am I going to put myself in that position (knowing my past reactions) with some random guy (or woman for that matter), no. If I'm gonna take the risk, it's gotta be worth it.

_____________________________________________________
Sincere thanks for another intelligent post.
(See, Double? He can stick up for himself).

I am truly sorry for you that you have the physical reaction you described.
I feel that it is medically unjustified as far as being a rational fear. Of course many fears are irrational.

I feel that, if everyone had your reaction, no one would admit to being HIV+, and then where would we be? Can you see how a prospective partner would be reluctant to disclose their positive status after an experience with someone who freaked out on them?

Thanks.

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

_____________________________________________________
Sincere thanks for another intelligent post.
(See, Double? He can stick up for himself).

I am truly sorry for you that you have the physical reaction you described.
I feel that it is medically unjustified as far as being a rational fear. Of course many fears are irrational.

I feel that, if everyone had your reaction, no one would admit to being HIV+, and then where would we be? Can you see how a prospective partner would be reluctant to disclose their positive status after an experience with someone who freaked out on them?

Thanks.

Thankfully there are plenty from the Neg tribe like yourself who do not share my reaction. We're all different.

As far as DMW, we're going to team up and tour the globe as the safe sex queens. We'll give free live demonstrations for anyone who'd like to see.

 

[Webster]

i think you are being overly harsh. the person deciding whether or not to engage in sexual activity has the right to choose who he or she wants. we all have preferences, be it age or nationality or intelligence level or religious standing etc. if your last sentence were referring to legal issues, i am with you 100 pct. but you have no right to expect someone to have sex with you no matter what. it has nothing to do with human rights. it is not your right to expect physical affection from someone that does not want to give it.

if a guy told me he had cancer and was going to die in a month, i'd not have sex with him. don't want to risk emotional attachment with someone who's not going to be around in a short period of time. thats a preference. it doesn't make me a bad person, and sorcerer's preference doesn't make him one either imho.

hiv transmission is NOT easily avoidable totally. its easily mitigated. you can reduce the risk to extremely low, but not entirely eliminate it if intercourse or oral activities are involved. some do not want to go down that road. that is their choice.

____________________________________________________

You're reading waaay too much into the original thread post.
Please go back and read it again.

Of course everyone is free to make choices and to say no at any time.

The hypothetical HIV - person was "hot to trot" until , just as they were about to have sex, the HIV+ partner revealed his status. It was only then that the negative person freaked out.

My entire argument is that practicing safe sex reduces the possibility of HIV transmission to a point so extremely low that there is no reason for panic. And it's certainly not a good reason for throwing away someone who just might be the "love of your life".

Regardless if Sorcerer cannot help his fears, I feel that they are extremely irrational.

If I was HIV + , and I was met with that kind of reaction, I would never again admit to being positive. It wouldn't be worth the irrational rejection.

 

[cooliorox]

I think that I would definitely have to tell her no. Don't think that I am ignorant, because I've done my research. Condoms are effective, but personally, not effective enough for something that will eventually kill me. I respect everyone's opinions, and I could still definitely have a meaningful relationship with a girl who is HIV+ without having sex.

 

[Webster]

last year i had about a three week fling with an amazing girl. she was hiv+. i'm sure i had more sex with her than i did with girls i've been in 'long-term' relationships with (heartthrob though i am). we used protection every time and everything went swimmingly. i've been tested since then and i'm still - thankfully - negative.


nevertheless, i completely see Sorcerer's point. hiv is an ominous disease - a sexually transmitted disease. thus, when one is having sexual intercourse with an hiv positive person their emotions are at their highest altitude. i don't think it's a matter of mentally and/or emotionally sequestering these people as it is properly interacting with them so that you both can enjoy a healthy relationship in everyway.


*hands out condoms to lpsg members*

__________________________________________________
Many thanks for your compassionate common sense post.

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

My entire argument is that practicing safe sex reduces the possibility of HIV transmission to a point so extremely low that there is no reason for panic.

Regardless if Sorcerer cannot help his fears, I feel that they are extremely irrational.

OK, now you pissed me off. "Extremely irrational"? No. AIDS is DEADLY.
Did you know that some brands of condoms have a 20% failure rate? My panic attacks may be irrational. The reason I get them isn't too terribly irrational. After that rubber broke (and I was on the bottom that time), I couldn't get the image out of my head of my fling's ex: emaciated and dying. I had panic attack #1 in the bathroom after we finished having sex. Now you know what's behind the attacks. Don't fling mud at me because I'm afraid of a deadly disease. Anyone who thinks that you're putting teflon over your dick every time you use a condom is living in a fool's paradise. There's ALWAYS risk.

On the subject of education: I think I've had about as much as I can without going to nursing school. I also volunteered at APLA, I had a job at a drop in center where most of my clients were HIV+ prostitutes. I've seen lots of wonderful people in various stages of decay.

AIDS is fucking scary. If you don't think so, that's your business. I'm not going to spout statistics to you. I'm glad you have a wonderful partner and your mixed status doesn't cause a problem. I've known couples in your situation who had unprotected sex for YEARS and one partner stayed negative.

So if fucking a hot guy who happens to be healthy and has an undetectable viral load doesn't bother you, go for it. There are people on this earth who don't like blondes either but I still managed to get plenty of dates. There are plenty of people willing to have sex with someone who is HIV+. I doubt a turn down from me will be the end of the world.

 

[Webster]

Goodness.
I thought this was a discussion.
There's definitely no reason to get pissed off.

I lived through the first days of the epidemic when Ronald Reagan's government was making plans to put Aids sufferers in internment camps.

I saw emaciated young men on the streets every day. I also saw compassionate people who nursed them and fed them and cared for them when some people were afraid to be in the same room with them.

Through the many years of this terrible epidemic, I have seen incredible advances in treatment and care so that being HIV+ is no longer a death sentence. Many people who went out on disability have gone back to work and they are leading completely normal lives.

During those years, gay men learned how to have great sex without becoming infected.

I choose to be informed about the actual risks of transmission, I use common sense, and I live my life without paranoia.

There is a far greater chance of me becoming injured or dying in a car accident than from contracting HIV.

I am happy to give to you the benefit of the doubt by assuming that you misunderstood my comments.

I wish you well.

 

[dcwrestlefan]

____________________________________________________

Regardless if Sorcerer cannot help his fears, I feel that they are extremely irrational.

If I was HIV + , and I was met with that kind of reaction, I would never again admit to being positive. It wouldn't be worth the irrational rejection.

nah. we are in total disagreement here. he is not irrational. and if you view that as a reason to lie, you are irrational. appreciate the discussion, but you are really wrong here.