What's the freakin' Repub alternative?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by B_spiker067, Dec 22, 2009.

  1. B_spiker067

    B_spiker067 New Member

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    All Republicans can do is say no.

    <rant>
    WTF are Republicans going to do about people with pre-existing conditions looking for insurance? Ans: Not a damn thing. Or work on some ridiculous idea that tort reform is the problem. Hint: It isn't. Insurance is as a mafia protection racket. Insurance salesmen suck, not lawyers.

    And the only thing liberals can do is professional supplication (i.e. mug people for a living).

    I'm sick of liberals(20%) and Republicans(20%), sick of the mother fuckers all.
    </rant>
     
    #1 B_spiker067, Dec 22, 2009
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2009
  2. rainbowknight

    rainbowknight New Member

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    Please continue to rant but don't give up. If we give up, there will be no one to carry on the war against a failed system.
     
  3. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    actually, the Repubs had presented the most intelligent response to the healthcare crisis

    inter alia, it would have reformulated the regulations insurers operate under, making it more competitive and accessible, similar to automobile insurance (do you know anyone who cannot access automobile insurance)

    it, of course, died in Congress, because it did not serve the interests of the large corporate insurers, which is the set of interests Obama and Dem Congress serve
     
    #3 B_Nick4444, Dec 22, 2009
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2009
  4. B_Nick8

    B_Nick8 New Member

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    I fuckin' hate the Republicans and, as you know, I fuckin' hate you (intellectually), too.
     
  5. Ethyl

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    That's idiocy. I know people who did not have access to car insurance. They lost their job and their credit score (yes, they check your credit score) plummeted low enough the insurance companies said they didn't qualify for anything but an outrageous amount. But, of course, they're stuck with a ungodly monthly payment or paying the fine if they're caught driving without insurance.

    Yes, that response is well-thought and benefits most people. We should definitely penalise others for not having health insurance because the ones who need basic health care can pay the fines without a problem. Right.
     
  6. B_spiker067

    B_spiker067 New Member

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    Didn't hear about it. Who sponsored it?

    Was it Chavez like price control?
     
  7. houtx48

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    nationalize insurance companies...............
     
  8. B_spiker067

    B_spiker067 New Member

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    NOOOOOO00000oooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    Socialize insurance (i.e. make them non-profit) as a last resort threat.

    Knock, knock, hello? Anybody home? How long have you guys been thinking about the issue so that you think you're entitled to an opinion? :tongue:
     
  9. B_VinylBoy

    B_VinylBoy New Member

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    Yeah, it was called "Death panel" and it was a lie. Next subject, please. :rolleyes:
     
  10. houtx48

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    ahh don't get your panties in a bunch spikie this congress is the best the insurance lobby can buy, they even bought Barry. over the years the insurance industry has wrangled lawmakers to forcing people to buy their product and their next dream is to have the industry deregulated.
     
  11. sargon20

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    Exactly. And that's how it works in health insurance. Except substitute credit score with 'pre-existing' condition and there you go insurance so high it's simply unaffordable if you can get it.
     
  12. BobLeeSwagger

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    It's a flawed comparison. When receiving an auto insurance quote, customers receive exact information on what their cost will be if there should be an accident. Health insurance is deliberately obscured so that consumers can't tell how much health care actually costs. Most people have no idea how much their employers pay for their health care benefits. They also have no way of knowing what it will cost them if, say, they suffer a broken leg or have a baby. Until the health insurance industry has to provide more transparency about costs and benefits, the argument that competition will solve the problem is moot.

    Granted, Democrats haven't really proposed a solution to this issue either. But to argue that Republicans have offered a real alternative is a fantasy. The GOP has pretty much admitted that their just being obstructionists now. Even if you buy the claims that it hasn't been paid for, stifles the free market, and creates an unnecessary entitlement, then hopefully you also believed that when Republicans jammed through a Medicare prescription drug benefit that had (and still has) the same problems.
     
  13. JacobFox

    JacobFox Member

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    Yeah, because liberals do nothing but support huge businesses... you lost any credibility right there.

    Wisest words ever by Family Guy, when asked what republicans do:

    "We help those who already have the means to help themselves."
     
  14. Ericsson1228d

    Ericsson1228d Member

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  15. FuzzyKen

    FuzzyKen New Member

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    Most of the fights on who is right or wrong fail to see where the problems are.

    Private Health Insurance Companies are profit making businesses. They must pay their CEO's competitive million dollar salaries to other equivalent corporate entities. In addition, those corporate entities are responsible to pay dividends to stockholders. All of this leads to an interesting situation. As the decades have passed and as corporate percs have increased, you the insured are paying for these percs.

    When Insurance providers talk about their problems they never talk about the administrative costs which they themselves have devised in the form of their highly paid executive staff. Also, many of these companies just like in banking and the Automotive industries pay year end bonuses to these top adminstrators for the incredible job that they have done at running the company.

    Now, let's look at this from a strictly business point of view.

    If you own a business and are making a profit, how much would you be willing to pay to make certain that you had no competition. How many lobbiests would you hire to defeat any measure which could place a competitor in the market which could drive down your prices, corporate profits and or executive percs?

    Every business is going to try and eliminate competition from the market. This is the plain and simple reason for great opposition to any kind of public option in health care at this time.

    In many states people receiving government funded state or federal medical aid receive far better care including for catastrophic illness than is provided currently even under the most deluxe plans offered in private insurance.

    Like it or not, the main problem in the entire industry is that profit is being placed in front of patient care and care is routinely denied via a number of routes which make they the insurance carriers look like little innocent children when they in fact are the ones determining who lives and who dies.

    For those conservatives who feel that change is not needed, your time is coming. There was a time I would have agreed with many of your points. I lost my Mother in 2001 because of "care denied" by a private insurance carrier. My Mother at the very end of her life suffered from hypertension. She had a heart attack. Her private carrier refused to pay for CCU, shipping her off right after a heart attack to a convalescent home where she was not even attached to a cardiac monitor. At the time of her heart attack normal cardiac care would have uncovered the abdominal aortic aneurysm that killed her. She was "discharged" from the convalescent home to return home in terrible condition because the private carrier would not even continue to pay for that. My Mother died nearly in my arms of a burst abdominal aortic aneurysm that common sense cardiac testing would have uncovered.

    Let me give you some interesting numbers:

    Lymphoma Cancer is often "capped" denial of care takes place usually at the end of the first year.

    Leukemia is also often "capped" depending on the type.

    If you are a diabetic with hypertension yes it is true that you can get insurance. But the average 30-year-old with these two preexisting conditions will pay about $2,500 per month for it.

    Medicine used to be our "family business". Until you have seen what Insurance Carriers have done to Medicine and the rather underhanded ways they use to deal with care providers, you have not lived yet.

    I hate to even mention these words, but, in the end whether we do it now or even begin to move in that direction with a "public option" the ONLY final solution will end up being socialized medicine. This is far less extreme than a flat out "government nationalization" procedure and the President of the United States has within his power the ability to Nationalize Private Industry if it is in the public good.

    I believe in the "free enterprise" system when people play by the rules and give a fair shake for what they get. The majority of health care providers are not broke because of MD's. They are broke because of gross financial mismanagement.

    If we want "gross financial mismanagement" we can at least have some chance through the electoral process and several of the very powerful investigative committees dealing with this kind of problem.

    Guaranteed to work? No, but then neither is trusting a number of corporate entities which have done everything possible to abuse those whom they insure.
     
  16. joyboytoy79

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    Yeah, did you notice the part about how States would be required to protect insurance companies against losses? Yeah, and the part about how that should all come out of the State budgets? And, remind me, please... where do states get their operating budgets?
     
  17. sargon20

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    But the rest of us are supposed to be happy with the crumbs they sweep off their plate.
    ...so long as power remains privately concentrated, everybody, everybody, has to be committed to one overriding goal: and that&#8217;s to make sure that the rich folk are happy -- because unless they are, nobody else is going to get anything. So if you&#8217;re a homeless person sleeping in the streets of Manhattan, let&#8217;s say, your first concern must be that the guys in the mansions are happy -- because if they&#8217;re happy, then they&#8217;ll invest, and the economy will work, and things will function, and then maybe something will trickle down to you somewhere along the line. But if they&#8217;re not happy, everything&#8217;s going to grind to a halt, and you&#8217;re not even going to get anything trickling down.
    Noam Chomsky​
    In the Real World of Work and Wages, Trickle-Down Theories Don&#8217;t Hold Up
     
  18. B_ccc888

    B_ccc888 New Member

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  19. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    looks like someone else already posted the link:

    Health Care - GOP Solutions for America - GOP.gov

    the tragedy was its presentation during a time of lib dem strength and control:

    The House Rules Committee decides the “structure of the debate” on each bill, and Democratic Speaker Pelosi controls the committee -- it is up to her to direct the committee on whether to declare the Republican proposal “in order.”

    “(Democrats) have a lot of members,” Doane said. “The two questions they have to ask themselves are, ‘Will it pass?’-- if so, (then it’s a) ‘big problem, don’t let it come up’ -- and the second one is, ‘Will they be hurting or helping their members by allowing them to vote on it?’”

    Doane said its possible Pelosi may allow the amendment to come up for consideration: “(The Democrats) can’t really bash the (Republicans) for not having a bill when they do not allow a vote on it.”

    CNSNews.com - House Republicans Offer Alternative to Pelosi?s Health-Care Bill

    the result was foreseeable (and thus intentional?) by the Obama decision to throw the issue to Congress, making it a process that historically has always favored decision-making in favor of the deep pockets (contrast that with the approach that other leftist who also inflicted damage on the Republic's safety, security, and well being, i.e., Clinton, who tried to avoid that process)
     
  20. B_Nick4444

    B_Nick4444 New Member

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    you mean States like California would actually have to draw up responsible, workable budgets, and fiscal policies?

    egads, man! :eek: egads!
    :eek:
     
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