What's Your Dreamhouse?

thadjock

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Instead of making blanket statements, you could at least try countering each one of my points, asshole.
hmm....u know i'm just not feelin the luv to motivate me to engage u at all

I don't need a degree in architecture or environmental engineering (which I doubt you have one either, (careful , that would be a lousy bet) by your spelling) to be well versed on this topic.


I may have said it was crappy advice, but it certainly wasn't a personal attack, Thadjock.
sooo, should i take being called an asshole, personally?

Maybe I'll write back in several years, from my energy-efficient concrete home! :)
yeah, maybe u can build it in the middle of that exhausted open pit strip mine where all the raw materials for your concrete & steel came from. The place where they had to clear cut all the trees off it b4 they could mine the materials to build ur house. creating a permanent wasteland where no trees will ever grow again, u know, right down stream from the petro-chemical plant that manufactures your polyethylene and polystyrene ICF components, is THAT the minimal environmental impact u were talkin about???

Trees grow, live, and die using nothing but solar power, without adding ANY net carbon to the earth's atmosphere, it's a process that would happen even if there wasnt' one human being here. and trees grow back, we've been progressively managing forests for over 100 years to sustainably build houses, last i checked, iron ore, gyspum, limestone and crude oil don't spontaneously regenerate. but i suspect u live in a more magical kingdom than I.

don't forget to install a sand pit so u can keep ur head buried in it.
 

D_Rod Staffinbone

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this used to be such a happy thread, not that i really care. it is entertaining (and informative too).
i've done the bickering thing myself in other threads.
 
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midlifebear

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yeah you're right, adobe is an excellent green material also. sun dried mud and a little straw. perfect.

and by cement i meant commercial portland cement used in modern concrete. One problem is, the raw materials still have to be mined out of the ground, I don't think anybody would call a strip mine or open pit mine very environmentally friendly. and fly ash is a waste by-product of burning coal in power plants, (i'm not sure how you get less green than that) and then it has to be re-processed for use in concrete, using even more energy. It also has high toxicity and low level radioactivy. using it in concrete is basically just a way to get rid of a huge pollution problem.

even limestone & gypsum ore need tremendous amounts of heat (natural gas, coal, wood, or electric kilns) to "burn" it removing the water so that when it re-hydrates it will become hard instead of just remain a water soluble paste. as far as wrights studio goes I think they would have had to build a way to process the lime on site, or they were using more of a rammed earth system which required a very low cement content (the two shovels per batch) even romans and egyptians had the technology of lime kilns to make durable mortar and plaster out of the rock.

we all want green to be easy, but we do seem to be willing to ignore the facts that don't fit our needs. keep it simple: think thoreau's cabin at walden pond, or if ur in the southwest, adobe.

thadjock:

Yes, it's true that cement/concrete isn't the most environmentally friendly substance. I'm not up to speed on what is contained in mortar mix, but I'm sure it's part Portland Cement. I'll have to spend even more time on the web spelunking about to find out.

But with regard to Wright's school/studio/community in Scottsdale the tour guides outright tell you that Wright's idea of "low impact" cement was far from perfect and didn't hold up well. He insisted that everything that was necessary to buld a structure was already on the land. Hence, his "organic" period that started in the 1930's. His students really did throw in shovelfuls of mortar mix when he wasn't looking. He was a bit of a tyrant and had more than a couple of hissy fits when he discovered a cement barrel mixer had been tampered with. At least once, he made his students dump the entire mix and start over. And if you look closely at the aggregate thrown into his cement it's obvious he used the gravel from the local dry stream beds and it isn't holding together very well. But to his credit he designed spaces that fit people, instead of vaulted castles. Although some of his classic prairie homes are a bit on the giant side.

His greatest success with Taliesin West was to create a non airconditioned community of buildings by excavating spaces, such as large meeting areas, (the formal theatre at Taliesin is a great example), so people were primarily underground where the temperature remained constant. Only elongated short windows supporting the ceilings let in enough ambient light -- and circulating air -- so you could read during the day without artificial illumination. And he was the master of creating breezeways between rooms where the natural convection of hot air passing through an expansive breezeway of shade created an outdoor space people could comfortably enjoy, even when it reached above 106 F -- which it often does in the Phoenix area.

He wasn't so much a "green" architect as one would wish.

A friend just sent me info on Wee Houses. Terribly interesting little things that are built to human scale and not castle-starter kit scale. Just click on the tiny boxes in the center of the web page to see the various extremely green homes. Still, they cost up to $200 a square foot. Alchemy Architects - weehouse
 

thadjock

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thadjock:

Yes, it's true that cement/concrete isn't the most environmentally friendly substance. I'm not up to speed on what is contained in mortar mix, but I'm sure it's part Portland Cement. I'll have to spend even more time on the web spelunking about to find out.
ya without going into a full dissertation, modern mortars and "mortar mix" that you buy at home centers is hydrated lime and portland cement in varying proportions depending on the type & application, sometimes with trace additives to impart strength or adjust set time. the third (and largest percentage) component being sand, or other aggregate like ground oyster shells.

But with regard to Wright's school/studio/community in Scottsdale the tour guides outright tell you that Wright's idea of "low impact" cement was far from perfect and didn't hold up well.
i wish the general public had a broader knowledge of architecture, i used to get so pissed off because if you asked the average person off the street to name an architect, 99.99% of the time it would be Wright. but I'm over that now, i'm older and realize that perception and PR count for more than actual accomplishment and talent. Wright was a brilliant media diva, and had the connections to get his work published, but there were many other contemporaries of his doing equal or better work who were totally ignored because of the glare of the spotlight on Wright.

He wasn't so much a "green" architect as one would wish.
true, but he was a brilliant concept guy, and at least seemed to think about the environment (inside and out). where he got into trouble was when he woudn't compromise the design even though it meant the engineering would be woefully inadequate. his most iconic house,fallingwater, nearly fell into the river b4 it was rescued by a recent major structural restoration and revision.

A friend just sent me info on Wee Houses. Terribly interesting little things that are built to human scale and not castle-starter kit scale. Just click on the tiny boxes in the center of the web page to see the various extremely green homes. Still, they cost up to $200 a square foot.

you hit the nail on the head, restricting size is the greenest thing you can do. I don't care what the house is made out of, or how little it costs to heat, a family of 4 living in 6000 sq ft is NOT GREEN. even if they drink their own greywater str8 out of the tub!
 

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you hit the nail on the head, restricting size is the greenest thing you can do. I don't care what the house is made out of, or how little it costs to heat, a family of 4 living in 6000 sq ft is NOT GREEN. even if they drink their own greywater str8 out of the tub!

Like . . uh, ewwwww fer ick!!!! And I'm sitting here trying to finish a glass of 2003 Trapiche Pinot Noir -- not because I'm a major drinker, but because I can't force myself to waste it by pouring it down the sink! to make gray water LOL!
 

patrick222

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My dream house would be the one I lived in as a child. We could walk to school, church, downtown, the YMCA, library, playground, swimming pool, grocery store, candy stores, drug store, doctor's office, hospital, dentist, barber shop, beauty parlor, bakery, ice cream shop, shoe repair shop. Bakeries, dairies and breweries delivered door to door, we had two neighborhod bars and pizza parlors and the buses ran to and from downtown every twenty minutes. The suburbs are a baren wasteland. The constant need for an automobile is not much better than being confined to a wheel chair
 

midlifebear

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thadjock:

Regardless of the thought of drinking gray water, thanks for the heads up on the contents of mortar.

And regarding Frank L., I feel your pain. He's not my favorite architect, but he was definitely a diva and an unavoidable one. It's still true that if you ask someone to name an architect you usually get Wright as an answer. When I was a kid (like 5 years old) I remember standing in front of and going in to Lever House on Park Avenue and that was it. I poured over books on architecture once I figured out what architecture was. I certainly knew it when I saw it when I was 5.

When I first clawed my way into university I took the Core Fundamentals of Basic Design (which also included photography) that was a two-year program one needed to complete before beginning pre-architecture. Architecture was exclusively a graduate school deal. It took four years and a lot of talent to qualify for the program. And during the same first two years I took all the biology courses about plants that were available: 1. Because I didn't have a car and it got me out of the city on regular weekend field trips; and 2. I just liked plants. But after finishing the two-year core curriculum I was detoured when I bought my first house (a four floor apartment building) just below Coit Tower in San Francisco that had real bay windows. I started a new career, taking buildings apart and putting them back together to at least their original foot prints. So much for making it into architecture school.

Until I was 24 or 25 I was still smitten with Mies van der Roh, Le Corbusier, Walter Gropius, et al. That glass curtain International Style seemed so cool and restrained. Now I'd like to throw rocks through most of the windows. But van der Roh's Crown Hall on the Illinois Tech campus still makes a lot of sense to me -- hanging the main structure from steel girders held up by steel columns. Can't say what it is. It just speaks to me.

Then in 1972 William Pereira's Transamerica Building was finished and the Bauhaus boyze suddenly lost their luster. But I'm still a sucker for the minimalist look. When I read Tom Wolf's from Bauhuas to Our House I was pissed. By then I'd pretty much been living with what people recognize today as "business lobby" furniture. But I've stood by my Barcleona lounge chairs, Wassily lounge chairs, and my Ray Eames lounger with matching ottoman. I won't give them up until I'm dead. Or the Mies chaise. They all seem perfectly at home in my piso in Barçelona. And as for Barçelona, OY! Antonio Gaudi sure has left his mark all over that city. My building is a pseudo Gaudi structure rendered rather faithfully in the modernísme style. Not to be confused with Art Deco. Different aesthetic altogether.

You name the style of home, and I've probably renovated it (except for the new pseudo "craftsman" style crap). And now, in Nevada, I've got this multi-level log cabin where the foundation is no longer a rectangle since being changed into a parallelogram by an earthquake a year ago, February 2008. It's true that the wooden logs are incredibly strong, structurally. If they weren't strong the county would have condemned the place. But I need to take it apart and rebuild it somewhere else.

I thoroughly respect your green aesthetic. However, despite the very real non-green reality of dense thermopane glass walls, zinc plated corrugated steel paneling, and radiant concrete floors, I'm gonna build a home that's small scale yet takes advantage of the 360 degree view of nothing but sagebrush desert. But the guts and skeletal structure will be stick built (prefab stick built, but still stick built). And except for a cluster of strategically clumped silvery turquoise Koster hybrid blue spruce, I'll try not to disturb the native landscape --- much. There are a few things that deer, elk, antelope, jack rabbits, voles, moles, field mice and cattle will not eat: any member of the daffodil family, hyacinths, lupines, pyracantha and Jimson Weed (daturis metaloides). So, I'll have to do a little naturalizing pottering about in the desert and planting clumps of these cultivated plants. Especially one stand of Datura that really gives off a great sinful sort of fragrance when the blossoms open at night. Despite what the Cattlemen's Association claims, cows are a lot smarter than we are and won't go near the stuff.

Still, if you ever have the opportunity (as in find yourself in Phoenix) by all means check out Wright's Taliesin West School of Architecture. And the Sausalito Civic Center is one Hell of a building (another Wright project that was made a main character in the film Gatica).

soon to be from the Midlifebear's retirement home (Im getting too old for these 12-hour non-stop flights).
 
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D_Ivana Dickenside

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i have a few different dream homes...

a cozy estate over looking the pacific ocean, kind of like the estates in palos verdes, CA. they're different from the estates in newport beach and the lagunas. i mean those are nice too, but they're nothing like PV.
http://www.katiemuck.com/images/property_images/prop021800.jpg


i'd also love a simple contemporary beach home like this one in manhattan beach, CA.
Contemporary Three Storey Home in Manhattan Beach


a high-rise loft or condo in a thriving downtown district. it has to have big open windows, wooden floors, stainless steel everything, and it'll be surrounded by buildings and bright lights. and, it'll still be close enough to walk the trendiest shops, bars, and restaurants. the downtown long beach area in CA is similar to what i'd want.
http://www.longbeachrealestatehome.... BEACH LUXURY HIGH RISE WATERFRONT CONDOS.jpg
 

SpeedoGuy

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And the Sausalito Civic Center is one Hell of a building (another Wright project that was made a main character in the film Gatica).

I lived near it until around age 21 and I saw it frequently (hard to miss it from US101 :rolleyes:). Been in it a few times too. It's indeed a marvel.