White nationalism

Discussion in 'Et Cetera, Et Cetera' started by Kassokilleri2ff, Sep 10, 2007.

  1. Principessa

    Principessa Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2006
    Messages:
    18,694
    Likes Received:
    90
    Gender:
    Female


    :biggrin1: ROTFLMAO Are you not from here originally? :confused: The reason the UNCF exists is because for over 100 years blacks weren't even allowed to learn to read let alone go to college. Black colleges were started so that blacks could become better educated and trained for careers in a safe setting. Many of these colleges and universities were run by the Methodist church or the Quakers.

     
  2. 36DD

    36DD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,771
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    12
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    U.S.
    I am sorry I offended...I wasn't meaning to imply anything or compare the two in anyway other than to say that I wish the color of one's skin or the origin of nationality should not be a basis for including or excluding one. Sorry, again, did not mean to offend and I know they cannot be compared to eachother...maybe or rather, I did use a poor analogy. Again, I am sorry.
     
  3. playainda336

    playainda336 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    1,991
    Albums:
    7
    Likes Received:
    2,132
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Greensboro (NC, US)
    Ironically, I'm a firm believer of not ignoring a problem. I think that's what causes us as a society to not be able to move forward.

    It doesn't help the case to say "let's just ignore race altogether in public, but behind closed doors we'll talk about it". No, what's needed is acceptance. I believe that's the reason White Nationalists exist...because so much is being covered up and not talked about and then it bubbles over in the hearts of a few people who collectively turn into a movement spawned out of ignorance and confusion.

    I think the solution to race problems is to talk about them and obtain understanding and not to say "I'm sorry I ever brought it up."
     
  4. 36DD

    36DD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2006
    Messages:
    1,771
    Albums:
    1
    Likes Received:
    12
    Gender:
    Female
    Location:
    U.S.
    I'm not saying that, I am just saying it was a poor analogy and I'm sorry for that. I don't think racism should be ignored either and I am sorry I am ignorant in the origin of the UNCF.
     
  5. frizzle

    frizzle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,045
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    London (GB)
    Then why is it still around? Seems pretty racist.
     
  6. skunkdawg

    skunkdawg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    frankfort, new york
    anyone can go to a historically Black college. I doubt many non-white can join a White nationalist group.
     
  7. frizzle

    frizzle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,045
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    London (GB)
    I though the UNCF was only for black people and only funded black people?
     
  8. DC_DEEP

    DC_DEEP Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    8,719
    Likes Received:
    31
    Howsabout "Pangaean-Terran?"

    I think I know what you are trying to say, but it just is not true.
    Source, please?
    Bad analogy, but I agree with you 100%. The UNCF certainly did serve its purpose at one time, but is unnecessary (and even a little divisive) now.
    The UNCF and Affirmative Action are both antiquated and counterproductive. They definitely served their purposes when they were founded, but both perpetuate segregational thinking. Race should not be a consideration, at all, for or against, for educational or employment purposes.
     
  9. skunkdawg

    skunkdawg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    frankfort, new york
    the uncf is used to maintain the colleges not to fund black people. Again the colleges are open to everyone. There are Whites, Hispanics and First nation people at the colleges.
     
  10. frizzle

    frizzle Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2006
    Messages:
    1,045
    Likes Received:
    3
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    London (GB)
    Ok I get you. The UNCF was set up to fund colleges that only black people go to as many couldn't afford or were not allowed to do it, but now their colleges are open to everyone?
     
  11. Osiris

    Osiris Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2007
    Messages:
    2,666
    Likes Received:
    9
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Wherever the dolphins are going
    Origianally yes, but as universities desegregated, it became a true scholarship fund for black people regardless of the Universities classification.

    The reason it is somewhat antiquated is that it hasn't kept with the times. I got a full boat scholarship to Stanford, partly on my grades, but partly because Stanford was heavily courting black students when I graduated high school. In the mid to late 80s, all the major universities were under pressure from the government for their "minority student" numbers (a la Affirmative Action). You could basically be black and have schools sending you scholarship funds just to look good.

    As to Affirmative Action, it has outlived it's usefulness. When Judge Lani Gunier helped author Affirmative Action it was meant to open the door to qualified black people to fitting jobs. As with most things designed to help, it has outlived it's usefulness and even more dangerous, it had become a weapon against the people it was desigend to help. Affirmative Action turned into a "quota doctrine". In the late 80s, there was a backlah on hiring blacks (primarily in businesses that favored segrationist politics). Blacks were being turned away because "We already have too many black people and we need to hire more white people to fill our quota."

    This is why a majority of black pepole feel that Affirmative Action is outdated. I want to say even Judge Guinier is on record as saying it either needs to be done away with or seriously revamped.
     
  12. skunkdawg

    skunkdawg Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2005
    Messages:
    25
    Likes Received:
    0
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    frankfort, new york
    Other races could always go to Black colleges but it is only in the last 20 years or so that more than just a scattering have attended. Prior to the 60"s and 70"s Whites were discouraged from attending these colleges. The discouragement came from the White society. A correction, the uncf does also does scholarships ofr Blacks. But Whites can also get scholarships to attend historically Black colleges. It also should be noted that in North America there are also schools for First Nation people and Metis people.
     
  13. deepwader

    deepwader Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 24, 2007
    Messages:
    214
    Albums:
    2
    Likes Received:
    35
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Cumbria (GB)
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by deepwader [​IMG]
    Everlyone a rittle bit lacist sometime!

    I think I know what you are trying to say, but it just is not true.


    ONE thing I am trying to say is that racism is in us all. We are better off acknowledging it is there and dealing with it than pretending it is possible to eradicate it. The other thing is that elevating racism to some sort of pinnacle of wickedness does not help us get along better in the long term. It is not uniquely appalling. If a fat black woman driver almost runs you over at the crossing, is there some sort of hierarchy of offence in yelling:

    (a) Stupid fat bitch!

    (b) Stupid black bitch!

    or just

    (c) Stupid fucking bitch!

    No, there isn't. Racism is part of the pettiness of being human. That is not to excuse it - rather, we all need to be on our guard against it and should look to ourselves as well as accuse others.
     
  14. playainda336

    playainda336 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    1,991
    Albums:
    7
    Likes Received:
    2,132
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Greensboro (NC, US)
    It shouldn't but for some reason people, like yourself, are so naive to believe that it doesn't take part in consideration. Why just a few weeks ago they told my band, at a restaurant in which we perform, (and we get full crowds of tipping customers everytime we perform) that they weren't going to give us anymore gigs because of the "crowd we attract".

    And what was our crowd, you ask? Well it was a fully mixed crowd. We had old people, young people, Black, White, and everything in between. We sang pop, alternative, country, R&B, reggae, Go-Go, and "old school". The only other bands that played there were either strictly country or strictly rock. I'm sure you can guess which crowds came for that.

    Are you trying to tell me that racism doesn't exist? That people don't make decisions based upon race? It happens, dude. That's why it's not antiquated or counterproductive. And I'm sure you DO know that Affirmative Action works in reverse as well...that is why a White person with bare minimum admissions requirements can go to my university with a full financial aid and I, with a 1300 SAT and 4.3 GPA, got $1,000 (total) from my school.

    I think the reason people don't like affirmative action is because they feel that issues like that are not fair, but the fact of the matter is that the system is in place ONLY to keep from taking 3 steps back from the 1 and a half that we've made forward. Affirmative action opens the door, but does not give you advancement in the work place...or keep your job for that matter.
     
  15. Shelby

    Shelby Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 17, 2004
    Messages:
    2,129
    Likes Received:
    7
    Location:
    in the internet
    Making her apologize for apologizing when she said nothing wrong to begin with eh?

    You've got the victim trip mastered fosho.
     
  16. DC_DEEP

    DC_DEEP Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    8,719
    Likes Received:
    31
    Alright, I will re-word my post: please do not employ the little psychological mechanism known as "projection." It is absolutely ridiculous for you to state as fact that you know I am racist. I am not. Just because you recognize it in yourself, that does not mean that all people harbor similar feelings.
    You call me naive; I will call you an idiot. Re-read my post which you quoted. Not once did I say "race is not a consideration", I said "race should not be a consideration." HUGE difference.
    That has nothing at all to do with education or employment.
    Again, re-read my post. I acknowledge that racism exists, I never said it doesn't. I'm just saying that UNCF and AA perpetuate, rather than mitigate, racism. If you don't understand what that means, perhaps you do need to get one of those scholarships and go back to school.
    In case you didn't notice, that's exactly the type of thing I was saying is wrong with racial quotas/criteria for admissions. Admissions should go, without any question at all, to the most qualified student. Period.
    The "victim mentality" will not facilitate any moves forward, either.
     
  17. playainda336

    playainda336 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2005
    Messages:
    1,991
    Albums:
    7
    Likes Received:
    2,132
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Greensboro (NC, US)
    It was not my attention to make her apologize, but to inspire further discussion on the matter. :confused:

    For that, I apologize. I did not mean to portray that message.
    "Should not" does nothing for reality. A lot of things "should be" but they are not.
    It does when you're trying to make a profession as a vocalist/musician.
    I understand exactly the words that you are saying. But what I do not understand is how they perpetuate racism? Maybe instead of taking every opportunity to insult my intelligence and being snipe, you should take the time to explain it to me. From your perspective.

    Because obviously "U R DUMASS! IJIOot!!!11ELEVEN!" isn't telling me anything.
    I agree. Unfortunately, it is not always the case. We can live in a fantasy world or we can live in reality.
    Let's not jump on bandwagons here, sir.
     
  18. DC_DEEP

    DC_DEEP Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2005
    Messages:
    8,719
    Likes Received:
    31
    You do not deny posting these statements in your reply to me, do you? Maybe I'm being dense here, but it seems that you are accusing me of making claims that racism does not exist. I have never in my life made such a claim; on the contrary, I see it and I find it abhorrant. From either direction.
    Hold that thought...
    I understand exactly what it means to be a professional musician. I have been one. I still assert that it is not the same as applying to a college or applying for most other kinds of jobs, especially white-collar/office/"professional" jobs.

    Now, back to where I asked you to hold that thought.

    You are saying that it's OK to give preferential admissions or hiring treatment under AA. I'm saying it's not. By retaining affirmative action, it does give preferential treatment, based upon race. When affirmative action was conceived, it was discriminatory, but it was a useful, necessary, justifiable tool to level the playing field. The field is now level.

    You keep talking out of both sides of your mouth. On one side, you say that admissions should be based solely on merit (and I agree). In the same breath, however, you say affirmative action should remain in place. You can't have it both ways. And as long as affirmative action is in place, race WILL be a consideration in hiring and admissions. What is so hard to understand about that? As long as affirmative action is in place, race WILL be a consideration. All I am saying is merit should be the ONLY criteria. It cannot be as long as AA and quotas are the standard.
    Where the fuck did that come from?
    Which is the fantasy and which is the reality? I can be an idealist and a pragmatic at the same time. Affirmative action is a crutch, and a bad one at that. It is currently the reality. I see nothing wrong with hoping for a less racist means of providing opportunities for those who want it and deserve it.
     
  19. Mrs. Donna Goldstein of New York

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2005
    Messages:
    29
    Likes Received:
    0

    DC DEEP, would you say that Yeshiva University perpetuates Educational segregation? What about all schools segregated by gender, especially since there are'nt any allowances made for members of the opposite sex to attend.

    How does the existence of a HBCU (Historically Black College or University)
    work against your educational opportunities? How does the fundraising for these institutions, lessen the endowment for other schools like the Multi-Billion dollar endowed Princeton. It's easy to say some things when you have as Paul Mooney would say "The complexion for the protection".
     
  20. kamikazee_club

    kamikazee_club Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 21, 2007
    Messages:
    133
    Likes Received:
    1
    In theory, sure, but in practice....you're kidding, (or naive) right?
     
Draft saved Draft deleted
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice