I understand what you're saying; however, I believe gay apps and to a lesser extent Craigslist and the like are a reflection of how gay men act towards one another. Obviously not all gay men are plugged into this matrix but you can't ignore that what mostly goes on in those apps mirror what goes on in public.
I understand what you're saying; however, I believe gay apps and to a lesser extent Craigslist and the like are a reflection of how gay men act towards one another. Obviously not all gay men are plugged into this matrix but you can't ignore that what mostly goes on in those apps mirror what goes on in public.
Also when people throw links at you (regardless of their relevance) look at the source. If a person wants to give you credible links they should use mainstream, respected sources (CNN, ABC, BBC, New Scientist, etc) as opposed to shit like 'The American Vision: A Global Biblical ministry (or whatever the fuck they're called) or 'Platonic D.R.E.A.M.S. (some BS anagram).
I'm not even saying the info. in the links is BS (though it could be) I'm just saying one should seriously question the validity of random sources like that.
And that said your OP is totally relevant and something we should be discussing.
Here goes:
You ask 'Why are white guys that are into black guys always either obnoxiously obsessed with large black penises belonging to underperforming and impoverished black men, or 45 years old and older that can no longer snag a cute blonde twink in his 20's/30's?'
OK, here's the problem with the post:
you present two and only two reasons that white guys can be into black guys.
There are other reasons why a white dude likes a black dude: physical beauty (not penis size), brains, abilities, or personality,
just to name a few possibilities. So there are more than two reasons why white guys can be into black guys.
Case in point, Shaqille O'Neal: great athlete, successful businessman, has at least two degrees- an MBA from University of Phoenix, and an Ed.D. in Human Resource Development from Barry University. Multi-faceted and wealthy to boot. Not an underperforming and impoverished black man, and I think he could, if he weren't straight, snag a cute twentyish or thirtyish blond twink or two. In fact, who wouldn't push past you to line up for his or Dwayne Johnson's bed?
When you go at a post with either/or forced choice rhetoric, it's as though I said about you 'Either Nellon399 eats his own shit or he fucks sheep'--does one of those necessarily have to be true? Of course not! And neither one of the choices you offer the readers of your post has to be true.
Besides the false dichotomy you offer, the characterization that black guys who have large penises are underperforming and impoverished is a great example of the logical fallacy, hasty generalization. Not all black men have large penises, and not all with black men with large penises are underperforming and impoverished. And 'underperforming'? You don't even specify the context of (under)performance sex? the theater? the stock market?
So do you really think white men over 45 who can't snag a a cute blond twink turn instead to black men for sex? Doesn't that stike you as a stupid thing to think? Do you really think all white guys over 45 actually want a cute blond twink?
All you offer is your own opinions in your post, and if those are formed based on your experience, then you need to get out more. Your characterizations of why white men who are into black guys are hasty, limited, narrow, and, well, stupid.
Corrected text from post 6004732 (which I had hastily typed in on a tablet)
Here goes:
You ask 'Why are white guys that are into black guys always either obnoxiously obsessed with large black penises belonging to underperforming and impoverished black men, or 45 years old and older that can no longer snag a cute blonde twink in his 20's/30's?'
OK, here's the problem with the post:
you present two and only two reasons that white guys can be into black guys.
There are other reasons why a white dude likes a black dude: physical beauty (not penis size), brains, abilities, or personality,
just to name a few possibilities. So there are more than two reasons why white guys can be into black guys.
Case in point, Shaquille O'Neal: great athlete, successful businessman, has at least two degrees- an MBA from University of Phoenix, and an Ed.D. in Human Resource Development from Barry University. Multi-faceted and wealthy to boot. Not an 'underperforming and impoverished' black man, and I think he could, if he weren't straight, snag a cute twentyish or thirtyish blond twink or two. In fact, who wouldn't push past you to line up for his or Dwayne Johnson's bed?
When you go at a post with either/or forced choice rhetoric, it's as though I said about you 'Either Nellon399 eats his own shit or he fucks sheep'--does one of those necessarily have to be true? Of course not! And neither one of the choices you offer the readers of your post has to be true.
Besides the false dichotomy you offer, the characterization that black guys who have large penises are underperforming and impoverished is a great example of the logical fallacy, hasty generalization. Not all black men have large penises, and not all black men with large penises are underperforming and impoverished. And 'underperforming'? You don't even specify the context of (under)performance--sex? the theater? the stock market?
So do you really think white men over 45 who can't snag a a cute blond twink turn instead to black men for sex? Doesn't that strike you as a stupid thing to think? Do you really think all white guys over 45 actually want a cute blond twink?
All you offer is your own opinions in your post, and if those are formed based on your experience, then you need to get out more. Your characterizations of why white men are into black guys are hasty, limited, narrow, and, well, stupid.
Here goes:
You ask 'Why are white guys that are into black guys always either obnoxiously obsessed with large black penises belonging to underperforming and impoverished black men, or 45 years old and older that can no longer snag a cute blonde twink in his 20's/30's?'
OK, here's the problem with the post:
you present two and only two reasons that white guys can be into black guys.
There are other reasons why a white dude likes a black dude: physical beauty (not penis size), brains, abilities, or personality,
just to name a few possibilities. So there are more than two reasons why white guys can be into black guys.
Case in point, Shaquille O'Neal: great athlete, successful businessman, has at least two degrees- an MBA from University of Phoenix, and an Ed.D. in Human Resource Development from Barry University. Multi-faceted and wealthy to boot. Not an 'underperforming and impoverished' black man, and I think he could, if he weren't straight, snag a cute twentyish or thirtyish blond twink or two. In fact, who wouldn't push past you to line up for his or Dwayne Johnson's bed?
When you go at a post with either/or forced choice rhetoric, it's as though I said about you 'Either Nellon399 eats his own shit or he fucks sheep'--does one of those necessarily have to be true? Of course not! And neither one of the choices you offer the readers of your post has to be true.
Besides the false dichotomy you offer, the characterization that black guys who have large penises are underperforming and impoverished is a great example of the logical fallacy, hasty generalization. Not all black men have large penises, and not all black men with large penises are underperforming and impoverished. And 'underperforming'? You don't even specify the context of (under)performance--sex? the theater? the stock market?
So do you really think white men over 45 who can't snag a a cute blond twink turn instead to black men for sex? Doesn't that strike you as a stupid thing to think? Do you really think all white guys over 45 actually want a cute blond twink?
All you offer is your own opinions in your post, and if those are formed based on your experience, then you need to get out more. Your characterizations of why white men are into black guys are hasty, limited, narrow, and, well, stupid.
Sorry I keep responding but I have to reiterate that I believe your post is valid and based on your experience as a black guy hooking up online.
Are you generalizing? Yes.
Does that disqualify the validity of your post? No.
Immediately following this response will be a white guy insisting your perception of reality is wrong and unfair.
Are you generalizing? Yes.
Does that disqualify the validity of your post? No.
Immediately following this response will be a white guy insisting your perception of reality is wrong and unfair.
Hi Tncentaur. Thank you for providing more detail with your original post. I do agree somewhat and believe that there can be other reasons as to why a white gay man can be interested in a black gay man as human attraction is complex. However, situations like this represent the minority.
First off, I can go on an either/or rhetoric because essentially all aspects of life represent a dichotomy if you ponder on that a bit, but I'm not here to argue this. The issue that I'm arguing is simple. Most white gay men who are attracted to black gay men either like said black gay men because of their penis size or because they are older. I think when I present this fact, black gay men that are interested in white gay men divert from this out of shame from the truth and use the excuse that they are somewhat detached, "disconnected from the Matrix," and that they don't stereotype all white gay men the same. When I present this fact to white gay men, they lie. Let's admit that white gays and white people in general have mastered the craft of lying. The majority of the responses that I have gotten from white gay men after reading my OP have been along the lines of ..."This post is ridiculous." "I like a black guy for his personality, etc." I have only read maybe 2 responses that are true and honest responses and reflect how white gay men view black gay men.
Genuinely speaking, the answers that are more in line with how white gay men perceive black gay men that I was looking for in my OP and that maybe 2 other fonts have said are the following:
- "I'm a bottom and I supremely enjoy big black cocks."
- "I'm older, semi out of shape white man who can no longer attract younger men of my race so I approach men of other races."
Are you able to interpret how embarrassingly factual and truthful answers are? Of course none of these white fonts want to admit those two reasons I just presented because they are indeed stereotypical and shameful thus instead they completely skip the truth serum and opt to answer my OP with responses like yours filled with inapplicable examples and disconnected realities. I could literally start a thread on LPSG stating that I am a hung black top looking for a white bottom and get several responses in seconds, and then start a similar thread stating that I am a black bottom looking for a hung white top and barely get any responses save a few from older, non-hung white men. I'll let you think about why this might be. You may believe that these are solely my opinions but they are not just that. I am black and I am gay and I know that plenty of black gay men agree with what I have to say.
And for the last time, I know this is an online forum and I understand that I don't have any pictures of myself but these interactions that I describe between white and black gay men indeed happen in public all the time. They happen just as much on hookup apps as they do in outside settings. Case in point, just look at how that other black font described the obnoxious white bottom at the wedding he attended that he refused to hook up with. Additionally, I don't understand why some of you don't realize that the internet is a space that mimics and reflects society. This is not a complex concept.
WillyLong
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Hello Nellon399,
There always has been and there always will be a hierarchy when it comes to level of physical attractiveness.
Within the black community, tall is preferred over short, fit is preferred over fat, young is preferred over old, Top is preferred over Bottom, BBC is preferred over SBC.
Based on your previous posts on this website, you’re a Bottom, a black bottom, and unfortunately for you, black bottoms are not the preferred brand of bottoms. Instead of dealing with your own sexual frustrations, you’d rather belittle the black men who are the preference, both in and out of the black community, i.e., masculine black tops with big cocks.
You want black men with big dicks, who can or prefer to top, who prefer non-black bottoms, to feel just as miserable as you.
You want white men who prefer black tops, i.e., not you, to feel guilty about their interracial attraction.
You’re frustrated that most white tops prefer bottoms that don’t have your skin tone or your hair texture.
There is a Top out there for you, but your internal hatred won't let you see him when he finally arrives.
As HotBulge said, it’s time for you take the chip off your shoulder, otherwise you’re going to miss out on the big dicked top, be he black, white or some other color, who prefers black bottoms. He’s going to walk right past you and your attitude, and head straight for the black bottom who’s at peace with himself and the world he lives in.
There always has been and there always will be a hierarchy when it comes to level of physical attractiveness.
Within the black community, tall is preferred over short, fit is preferred over fat, young is preferred over old, Top is preferred over Bottom, BBC is preferred over SBC.
Based on your previous posts on this website, you’re a Bottom, a black bottom, and unfortunately for you, black bottoms are not the preferred brand of bottoms. Instead of dealing with your own sexual frustrations, you’d rather belittle the black men who are the preference, both in and out of the black community, i.e., masculine black tops with big cocks.
You want black men with big dicks, who can or prefer to top, who prefer non-black bottoms, to feel just as miserable as you.
You want white men who prefer black tops, i.e., not you, to feel guilty about their interracial attraction.
You’re frustrated that most white tops prefer bottoms that don’t have your skin tone or your hair texture.
There is a Top out there for you, but your internal hatred won't let you see him when he finally arrives.
As HotBulge said, it’s time for you take the chip off your shoulder, otherwise you’re going to miss out on the big dicked top, be he black, white or some other color, who prefers black bottoms. He’s going to walk right past you and your attitude, and head straight for the black bottom who’s at peace with himself and the world he lives in.
WillyLong, I understand the idea behind your post. What you said is true and in some ways parallels my OP, so thank you for the supporting response. Given what you've written and the fact that you username is, "WillyLong" it's safe to assume that you are as well a gay black man. First off, let's get one thing clear. I'm not miserable. I don't know why you would think this. Nowhere in my posts have I said this, and if my responses come across as that then you have misinterpreted them.
I don't harbor any internal hatred. I don't throw pity parties for myself. What I do is observe. I observe how blacks, such as how you have described in your post that I'm responding to, fit into a single narrative among gay men. And, once remarks are made in observance of that narrative, people, including yourself, get very defensive. I sense defensiveness rampant in your post. Please stop that behavior as I did not mean to neither offend you nor my fellow gay black men.
Lastly, there is no chip on my shoulder. I simply observe what I see based off of my interactions and the interactions that occur among others. Again, thank you for your response.
Anton565
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Two thoughts:
1. Any sub-group that stands out in a loud and obnoxious way will always appear to be a greater % of the total group than they really are. In this case we're talking about middle-aged white men with a bbc obsession. Since you appear to be a member of their target group you'll encounter them more often than you will such men who don't have a bbc obsession. Therefore bbc-obsessed middle-aged white men seem to be far more common than they actually are. Am I making sense?
2. People of color in general ridiculously, comically, UNDERestimate white cluelessness when it comes to anything to do with race or ethnicity. Most white people are largely oblivious as to how the playing field is not level. Most do not see how various systems in society are skewed to benefit them. Most white people live in such bubbles that even ethnic whites are subtly 'othered'.
In my line of work I hear/read a lot of whiteness being implicitly positioned as the center or the norm. I submit that most white people do not even have this concept.
This is just a hunch based on personal experience but I'd bet that most of these bbc-obsessed white guys have little or no interaction with black people outside of the venues in which they're chasing black men.
I guess my point is that most of the bbc men we're taking about would be unable to understand most of this thread.
1. Any sub-group that stands out in a loud and obnoxious way will always appear to be a greater % of the total group than they really are. In this case we're talking about middle-aged white men with a bbc obsession. Since you appear to be a member of their target group you'll encounter them more often than you will such men who don't have a bbc obsession. Therefore bbc-obsessed middle-aged white men seem to be far more common than they actually are. Am I making sense?
2. People of color in general ridiculously, comically, UNDERestimate white cluelessness when it comes to anything to do with race or ethnicity. Most white people are largely oblivious as to how the playing field is not level. Most do not see how various systems in society are skewed to benefit them. Most white people live in such bubbles that even ethnic whites are subtly 'othered'.
In my line of work I hear/read a lot of whiteness being implicitly positioned as the center or the norm. I submit that most white people do not even have this concept.
This is just a hunch based on personal experience but I'd bet that most of these bbc-obsessed white guys have little or no interaction with black people outside of the venues in which they're chasing black men.
I guess my point is that most of the bbc men we're taking about would be unable to understand most of this thread.
1. However, situations like this represent the minority. This is an assertion that you cannot and do not prove.
2. Let's admit that white gays and white people in general have mastered the craft of lying. This is a categorical statement that belies the fact that some men of all races do, in fact, tell lies. The fact that you claim white gays and white people are masters of the craft of lying is your prejudice for all here to see.
3. Twice you use the word fonts. A font is a weight and size of typesetting. What the fuck are you talking about?
4. Are you able to interpret how embarrassingly factual and truthful answers are? Facts do not embarass me, but you aren't presenting facts, only your opinions. And if this is a fact of your life, you are speaking from the standpoint of a single man with limited experience.
5. I could literally start a thread on LPSG stating that I am a hung black top looking for a white bottom and get several responses in seconds, and then start a similar thread stating that I am a black bottom looking for a hung white top and barely get any responses save a few from older, non-hung white men. And that would prove nothing. I can post two lies and get responses, too: what would that prove?
6. I am black and I am gay and I know that plenty of black gay men agree with what I have to say. Well, then, get 200 gay black men to show up in this thread and agree with you. Just because you're black, you're not an authority--you're one man with an opinion.
7. Additionally, I don't understand why some of you don't realize that the internet is a space that mimics and reflects society.
And it mimics and reflects some of the worst, as well as some of the best, of society. The internet ain't all good, buddy. The appeal to the majority is another rhetorical fallacy.
8.This is not a complex concept. You're right--it's simple and it's stupid.
I am done with this: you persist in being illogical, are prejudiced, and a man with little experience--but more than that, you're a waste of time.
I hope you get better, I really do.
Tncentaur, your brilliant response says a lot about you and the blatant denial that white gays live in. Thank you for posting this. It's a shame You don't see how you have actually proven my point without even realizing it. For you, instead of getting better and writing defensively on message boards, I hope that you interact with more gay black men. Maybe this will open up your mind a bit more instead of coming into my thread with your fallacies.
Thank you for your comment and I would agree. Take Tncentaurs' comments as prime examples of this.
I would also add that people of color don't underestimate white cluelessness. We are fully aware of this. White people underestimate their own cluelessness. Nonetheless, thank you for your responses. You've gotten the idea so far!
I agree with this as well. And the ones that don't avoid blacks usually fall into the two categories or perhaps both simultaneously that I stated in my OP.
Nellon,
Let's summarize the consensus view in this thread slightly differently:
Let's summarize the consensus view in this thread slightly differently:
- NO ONE denies your legitimate frustration for experiencing fetishizing, dehumanizing behavior. You are not a piece of meat nor an object for someone's racial fantasy of the power of BBC.
- Just as it is incorrect/wrong for people to reduce you to a fetish, it is equally wrong of you factually and rhetorically to generalize about the evils of all gay White men. A stereotypical generalization such as "All Black men are thugs" is equally as wrong, dangerous, and unfair as "The White man is the devil". Neither statement is true!
- About the Internet and online dating apps such as Grindr, we are trying to convey to you that those tools are used for quick sexual fixes, reliefs, and thrills. They are designed for "catalog shopping" of men and sexual encounters and transactions; they weren't necessarily designed for people to build relationships. You are essentially on the meat market exchange. To build a relationship, regardless of race, two people need to take the time to know each other.
- It is annoying to hear older adults make statements like "learn from my experience", but several people have expressed views to help you reduce your frustrations. You are setting yourself up for frustration because you have closed off the possibility of encountering decent gay, White men who may be interested in knowing you personally as an individual. "Mr. Right" gay White guy could be someone you went to school with or a friend of a friend. You need to be open to the possibility rather than dismissing all gay White men. IT would be sad to live a lifetime of frustration (perhaps the next 60 years for you) because you were close-minded and on the defensive.
Would you happen to know how gay men of different races interact in Brazil? It's a large country so maybe there are differences in certain areas but maybe things stay the same overall. I went to São Paulo for a quick work trip and thought that the white guys there acted the same as US whites.
I hear what you're saying HotBuldge, but can I ask you why do you think I'm frustrated? Is it because you were once frustrated and then learned to move on and accept things as they are? This is a serious question. From your posts I really get from you that you want all the work to be done by black men and have him accept things the way they are and not paint white men in the same manner that they paint us. Instead of calling them out and making threads like this in observance of how they treat us, you want me to turn the other cheek and realize that not all of them (yea right) are like this. I don't like this behavior, especially coming from another black person. You think you advice has merit but as I just stated, I don't believe so.
Also, I don't see any harm in observing how interactions unfold. As I've said before. These are my observations. If any of you don't like truthful observations, then don't read my posts. From reading these responses, one could honestly think that I'm the only black gay guy that has noticed this.
