Will Barack Obama win the 2012 US Election?

[B_VinylBoy]

As far as Obama being a great uniter of people of different opinions, lets consider when he accused a cambridge police officer of acting stupidly and implying he was a racist, just for doing his JOB. What a great day that was for race relations.

Obama never implied race when he referred to the cop that arrested Harvard Professor Henry Louis Gates Jr. stupid. That's because everyone in America also agreed that the cop's actions were indeed STUPID. I guess in your world Obama was also implying race when he called Kanye West a jackass for what he did to Taylor Swift on the VMAs.

What a day for intellectualism... the lack of, that is!

 

[dewarsman22]

Actually he did imply race played a factor. Here is the video of the press conference, see for yourself. Presidential News Conference : MSNBC

 

[B_VinylBoy]

Actually he did imply race played a factor. Here is the video of the press conference, see for yourself. Presidential News Conference : MSNBC

Which is, of course, why he invited BOTH the cop and Gates to the White House to settle tensions. Just like you said before, what a great day that was for race relations. Too bad you're now trying to spin it several months later to imply that Obama is a racist.

 

[JTalbain]

I think Obama will take the election in 2012, just as long as he can keep the Republican Party from taking too much credit for any good that happens between 2010 and 2012. DADT is awaiting destruction pending the military study that is due to be completed in December, the economy is now on an upswing that will start to make its presence known in about a year to 18 months, people will have witnessed the savings due to health care reform over two years (which, having been branded "Obamacare" is kind of hard for Republicans to take credit for), and people will have another two years of noticing their financial situations getting better due to both the economy improving and the financial safeguards installed by the administration. On top of that, by 2012, despite all the "government expansion", the deficit will be lower than now.

Basically, Obama has planted the seeds for success in a couple of years. Democrats might lose the midterms, but he'll have a pretty strong platform when he is running for reelection.

 

[ECUBiBoy]

If it makes the Obama-bots feel any better, what will probably happen is that somebody like Mitt Romney will win the 2012 election and promptly begin an even worse presidency than Obama. You can just look at all of the recent presidents and see that they get worse and worse every time. At least Obama won't be remembered for much when compared to some of the other two-term, disaster presidents (Clinton, Bush, etc.).

 

[B_VinylBoy]

If it makes the Obama-bots feel any better

And the true colors start to reveal themselves once more.
Steadily losing more credibility with every ASCII character. Congrats!!

what will probably happen is that somebody like Mitt Romney will win the 2012 election and promptly begin an even worse presidency than Obama.

You think the Christian zealots of this nation are ready to see a Mormon run the country after they fought tooth and nail to get rid of someone who they believe with every fiber of their body is a Muslim?

You can just look at all of the recent presidents and see that they get worse and worse every time. At least Obama won't be remembered for much when compared to some of the other two-term, disaster presidents (Clinton, Bush, etc.).

Yeah, somehow everyone will forget the following things that were signed into law under the Obama Administration - The Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, Credit Card Reform Bill, The Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, Hate Crimes Bill, Children's Health Insurance Bill, Student Loan Reform, Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act, Cash For Clunkers, Veterans Health Care Budget Reform & Transparency Act, Consolidated Appropriations Act of 2010, Caregivers & Veterans Omnibus Health Services Act... Oh, and yeah, the Stimulus Bill (which is the largest investment in Clean Energy & Education on record), plus the first stages of Health Reform and Wall Street Reform. All of this in the last 21 months. Such a disaster, isn't it? Especially when the goal is to win an election and label Obama a Socialist/Fascist/Marxist/Muslim/Kenyan/Teleprompter reading terrorist who wants to increase government, raise taxes (even though policies implemented by the current administration cut taxes 25 times) install death camps and pull the plug on Grandma.

If this was a disaster, then I can't even imagine what you consider a success. But hey, don't let the facts sway you from your "staunch" beliefs. The GOP is poised to take over and then some miracle super-Libertarian is going to come to the rescue (disguised as a Republican) and save us all.

If you need to find me, I'll be at the bar with some friends and a few bottles of Pravda.

 

[Drifterwood]

My predictions are always wrong.

I don't think that he will get re-elected.

I haven't voted because I am a Brit, and there isn't an option for returning to the Motherland. :tongue: Tea Party - sheeeeesh, bloody lucky you got any tea.

 

[ECUBiBoy]

And the true colors start to reveal themselves once more.
Steadily losing more credibility with every ASCII character. Congrats!!



You think the Christian zealots of this nation are ready to see a Mormon run the country after they fought tooth and nail to get rid of someone who they believe with every fiber of their body is a Muslim?



Yeah, somehow everyone will forget the following things that were signed into law under the Obama Administration - The Lilly Ledbetter Fair Pay Act, Credit Card Reform Bill, The Family Smoking Prevention and Tobacco Control Act, Hate Crimes Bill, Children's Health Insurance Bill, Student Loan Reform, Edward M. Kennedy Serve America Act, Cash For Clunkers, Veterans Health Care Budget Reform & Transparency Act, Consolidated Appropriations Act of 2010, Caregivers & Veterans Omnibus Health Services Act... Oh, and yeah, the Stimulus Bill (which is the largest investment in Clean Energy & Education on record), plus the first stages of Health Reform and Wall Street Reform. All of this in the last 21 months. Such a disaster, isn't it? Especially when the goal is to win an election and label Obama a Socialist/Fascist/Marxist/Muslim/Kenyan/Teleprompter reading terrorist who wants to increase government, raise taxes (even though policies implemented by the current administration cut taxes 25 times) install death camps and pull the plug on Grandma.

If this was a disaster, then I can't even imagine what you consider a success. But hey, don't let the facts sway you from your "staunch" beliefs. The GOP is poised to take over and then some miracle super-Libertarian is going to come to the rescue (disguised as a Republican) and save us all.

If you need to find me, I'll be at the bar with some friends and a few bottles of Pravda.

There's no miracle libertarian coming to save the day. This wretched system will collapse on its own due to unsustainability.

None of those pieces of legislation did anything to help the "problem" they were purported to fix. Just because somebody drafts something that sounds nice (oooo, fair pay act!), does not mean it helps anybody. The government has no right to interfere with the employer/employee negotiation process as it pertains to pay. It has no business buying out student loans. All of the attempts to save the environment/bolster education have just led to increases in consumer costs (and no demonstrable improvement). The government turns everything it touches to crap. Did you really think you could make a meaningful contribution just by listing pieces of legislation?

I don't know if Obama wants to put grandma in a concentration camp, but his administration is currently enforcing the policy of putting her through a porno scanner any time she goes to an airport. Is strenghtening the evils of Bush's Patriot Act "change you can believe in?"

 

[B_VinylBoy]

None of those pieces of legislation did anything to help the "problem" they were purported to fix. Just because somebody drafts something that sounds nice (oooo, fair pay act!), does not mean it helps anybody.

And it's so funny that you mention one of the most specific of the legislation for your dismissive bullshit. The Fair Pay Act is designed to specifically target the issues with women and how many of them are not paid the same rates as men for the same jobs.

The government has no right to interfere with the employer/employee negotiation process as it pertains to pay.

BULLSHIT. If a woman does the same job as a man, they deserve to be paid the same. Period. Historically, women have been paid less than men for the same level profile jobs. This has nothing to do with salary negotiations because in many entry level positions there are none. This is more proof that you don't know what the hell you're talking about. Again, quit while you're already behind.

It has no business buying out student loans.

BULLSHIT AGAIN. Federal Student Loans are funded by the Government to begin with. The banks were the middle men that did the negotiations on behalf of the government, and they were the ones that added on their excessive fees and penalties to make it more difficult for struggling people to pay. Silence is golden. Practice it, or continue to look foolish.

All of the attempts to save the environment/bolster education have just led to increases in consumer costs (and no demonstrable improvement).

Yet no links to prove this. Just more ideological bullshit as usual.
Back it up or shut the f*** up.

The government turns everything it touches to crap. Did you really think you could make a meaningful contribution just by listing pieces of legislation?

Well obviously, you don't know a damn thing about the bills I've listed and how they actually affect American citizens so you're in no place to tell me whether or not anyone of them are meaningless. Too bad your staunchly held political ideologies prevent you from paying attention to any of the details.

I don't know if Obama wants to put grandma in a concentration camp, but his administration is currently enforcing the policy of putting her through a porno scanner any time she goes to an airport. Is strenghtening the evils of Bush's Patriot Act "change you can believe in?"

Oh, you mean that full body scanner that was first used in 1992 and installed in airports as early as 2007? No, it can't be that one. Please say it isn't. I mean, I know you're an idiot and all, but don't make it that easy.

I'll warn you one more time... stop while you're already behind.

 

[D_Martin van Burden]

I'm more than fine with abolishing Don't Ask Don't Tell, but if you think that's going to make much difference on anything, you've been mislead. I see this as a cheap nugget being thrown to the "gay vote" in order to get them to stay in the Democrat corner.

Nobody's going to respect gay rights (whatever that really means, as if there are certain rights endowed to gays that are not endowed to others) until people remember how to respect INDIVIDUAL rights. If we fracture human dignity into all these various groups and designations, we'll never have more than a totalitarian society. Don't expect government to make this better. It has to begin with everyday people.

Keep in mind, I did not say anything about abolishing marriage either. I said abolish marriage LICENSES. Step back and think about it for a second. Why in the world do we need a license to get married? What business is it of the state's? Most of these licenses that we have to have today are relics of a time where the state didn't want blacks to marry whites or own guns. People who support licenses are unwittingly endorsing archaic Jim Crow Laws. So, those of you who are hung up on race now know that it's the government that propagates racism. Libertarians fight against it.

Two quick things.

First, I'm really surprised at your use of the verbiage "gay rights" when supporters of marriage for all are abundantly clear that the marriage rights they demand are the same rights extended to everyone else. I'll also ask you to note well that when civil rights movement get phrased in universal language in the debate process, odds significantly improve for passage. The NAACP did it with redlining; the HRC is jumping on this wagon too.

Second, I'm less clear about this, but I thought marriage licenses and documentation were necessary components for filing joint life insurance policies, survivorship policies, and key for transmitting and inheriting wealth between spouses in the event of loss of life. If not that, then the marriage license is one piece of the marriage contract (since you seem to be pretty fond of that language) that codifies the union between two spouses.

Since I've already told you how I feel about leaving altrustic and egalitarian decisions up to individuals, I'll spare the reminder.

I'll just say this. I'm personally ambivalent about marriage myself. At 30, I'm really unsure about that decision, specifically because I'm absent that type of life partner right now and I would like to spend whatever wealth I make primarily caring for my family first. Should a spouse come along, that's cool; she would just need to know my decisions about supporting family in addition to spouse. But what's undeniably clear in my mind is that my personal decision about marriage should not impact the right of other people who genuinely want to get married -- licenses, tax breaks, and all -- to each other. There's too much at stake, not only in the union, but in inheriting and sharing property, combining assets, providing significant medical and end-of-life decisions (all the more relevant given prohibitions of gay spouses to make that decision, especially if the family of origin is absent), and more.

I get all that, and I'm straight. What's your problem?

 

[swordfishME]

Given tonight's results Obama's chances for re-election have drastically improved. I think the key to defeating him is in the GOP nominee. At this point there is no way that the Tea Baggers will accept anyone other than a dyed-in the wool conservative christian zealot as the nominee (think Huckabee rather than Romney). Unfortunately for them this nominee with have zilch appeal to the independents that are so crucial for winning.

 

[DevonTexas]

I voted for him and hoped for better results; much better. I know change takes time, but he has made some poor decisions which I can't overlook. He won't win re-election.

But here's my biggest fear...

I'm afraid this massive Tea Party movement will only keep generating hostility which in corners of America, will turn into very violent hate and that, will be acted on towards him. The results of that (and you know what I'm talking about here), will be a very dangerous class/race outcry and possible domestic bloody rebellion.

 

[B_Nick4444]

a number of us (correctly) predicted a one-term presidency for the immigrant on that tragic evening two years ago

the elections last evening and earlier in the year in January, unprecedented historically in shear numbers and intensity, have been a stunning repudiation of everything that demagogue stood for

had the Senate seats been the subject of national scope, instead of just representing about a third, that chamber would have gone Repub, as well

by capturing control of the House, investigations and dialog will open up in examination of Obama, and everything lib dem, that would have otherwise been foreclosed

just as in 1994, we will see the surviving dems holding office move right in their speech and actions

man, can't hardly wait :smile:

 

[B_VinylBoy]

just as in 1994, we will see the surviving dems holding office move right in their speech and actions

Ultimately, clearing the path for Clinton to win in 1996. You may want to pick your historical distortions a little better if you're still on this OBAMA BAD crusade.

 

[midlifebear]

I'm of the opinion that Obama will with in 2012. But by December 21st, 2012 it won't matter too much.

 

[dandelion]

I voted for him and hoped for better results; much better. I know change takes time, but he has made some poor decisions which I can't overlook.

What do you consider were his bad choices?

I'm afraid this massive Tea Party movement will only keep generating hostility which in corners of America, will turn into very violent hate and that, will be acted on towards him.

Presumably in 2 years the tea/republican parties will be claiming they could not accomplish anything because obama blocked them. So it may well be a re-run of this election. On the other hand, the reps will have had 2 years to make proposals which he blocks. People will be able to judge what they do propose. This might bring about some distaste of the reps. presumably those elected who are now teapartyers will be demanding their own agenda which may differ from the reps. Could be next time will be the true tea victory. But that doesnt mean obama is doomed.

Dont forget the economy. Still sliding towards a cliff? The next two years may be more a public relations battle than any great change in federal policy.

Im still waiting for the spectacle of total gridlock between president and congress over the budget and a total shutdown of the federal system. Who would win that one?

 

[dandelion]

the elections last evening and earlier in the year in January, unprecedented historically in shear numbers and intensity, have been a stunning repudiation of everything that demagogue stood for

Hardly its just the usual slight shift. People knew that when they voted, too.

by capturing control of the House, investigations and dialog will open up in examination of Obama

You think it is really good for democracy that one part of government, when it cannot defeat another constitutionally, seeks to get rid of him by other means?

 

[B_VinylBoy]

Im still waiting for the spectacle of total gridlock between president and congress over the budget and a total shutdown of the federal system. Who would win that one?

You can see it coming a mile away.
1. House Republicans pass a bill. The Senate don't get enough votes.
2. House Democrats try to pass a bill. House Republicans block it.
3. House Democrats pass a bill. It's filibustered by the minority party in the Senate.
3. House Republicans pass a bill. The Senate begrudgingly passes it. Vetoed by Obama. Two-thirds majority vote practically impossible based on numbers.

There's still too much party politics being played and it's not going to stop since the ultimate goal for Teapublicans is to undo everything Obama did, impeach him or make him a one-term president. It's gonna be one long two years. Luckily my industries are not affected by what goes on in Congress so I'm not that worried. Although the continued ignorance spouted by Teapublicans who see the finish line even before it's drawn will continue to annoy the hell out of us.

 

[mwealex]

I certainly hope not.

 

[B_Nick4444]

[/COLOR][/B]Hardly its just the usual slight shift. People knew that when they voted, too.

slight shift doesn't quite capture it; the shift was a staggering repudiation, and exit polls show just how definitively the electorate meant it

You think it is really good for democracy that one part of government, when it cannot defeat another constitutionally, seeks to get rid of him by other means?

(1) if there are sufficient and compelling grounds, yes

(A) in Obama's case, the grounds are indeed compelling; and,

(2) that was envisioned by the framers from the beginning