Women who don't really like other women.

[luka82]

I see some of my friends married to "yummy mummies" and you would be forgiven for thinking that we lived in a Matriarchy.

You could read vogue and be forgiven for thinking that women objectify themselves.

That said, this thread was not about these things. Though feel free to discuss whatever you want.

I am a bit worried as to what it makes me that I like someone who hates me.

Drift if I may say it and please don`t hate me for it-You are one classy act!:wink:

 

[ManlyBanisters]

Dealing drugs. So blame the drug addicts when the poor dealer gets busted!

This is you saying that women are nasty, opportunistic sluts for making porn and giving all those poor men something to beat off to.

And you expect me to take anything you post seriously ever again, do you?

You would have the bedraggled making of a point if porn producers were predominantly female. But they aren't, so you don't.

Well done!

:clap:

You're trying to make this into some pathetic point scoring thing, are you?
I see. Well, that's nice, isn't it, dear.

If people are going to make this a man verses woman point scoring farce rather than an actual debate of an interesting topic then my participation in this thread is over.

 

[alwaysguessing]

You're trying to make this into some pathetic point scoring thing, are you?
I see. Well, that's nice, isn't it, dear.

If people are going to make this a man verses woman point scoring farce rather than an actual debate of an interesting topic then my participation in this thread is over.

I thought he made a good point and I expressed appreciation. What does that have to do with "man vs. woman". Don't project your gender-based hostility onto me.

 

[SilverTrain]

This is you saying that women are nasty, opportunistic sluts for making porn and giving all those poor men something to beat off to.

And you expect me to take anything you post seriously ever again, do you?

You would have the bedraggled making of a point if porn producers were predominantly female. But they aren't, so you don't.



You're trying to make this into some pathetic point scoring thing, are you?
I see. Well, that's nice, isn't it, dear.

If people are going to make this a man verses woman point scoring farce rather than an actual debate of an interesting topic then my participation in this thread is over.

[Is that last bit a challenge? :tongue:]

I have no intention of defending the porn industry. But the argument that women are "sucked into it" rings patently false. I cannot agree that the inducement of high wages for relatively short work is, in and of itself, "exploitation". At least in, say, the US/Western Europe, people are not drafted into porn service against their will.

Now, is it a particularly nasty industry in which to work? I have no actual knowledge, but I'd say, probably. So don't work in it. And don't watch it. And feel free to condemn anyone who does either.

As to the OP, (despite decades of research) my understanding of the female mind is limited. And I would thus defer to those who know.

 

[SilverTrain]

This is you saying that women are nasty, opportunistic sluts for making porn and giving all those poor men something to beat off to.

Oh, and thanks for telling me what I am thinking/saying. I thought that was on the "NOT" list this week.

 

[Drifterwood]

please don`t hate me for it

Hate my Luka

Three open mouths must confuse you :biggrin1:

How about www.allthingscfnm.net does this objectify women?

 

[dolfette]

You could read vogue and be forgiven for thinking that women objectify themselves.

true.

stereotypical men often compete over stupid shite like todgers & sport & cars.
stereotypical women often compete over stupid shite like looks & clothes & kids.

we've all seen it to some degree.

 

[petite]

Hate my Luka

Three open mouths must confuse you :biggrin1:

How about www.allthingscfnm.net does this objectify women?

Yes it does, because they're the objects of sexual desire. It's porn, the purpose is to arouse, which involves objectification. There's nothing inherently wrong with that.

If objectifying women causes a man to disrespect her, or all of womankind, then it becomes harmful, but the objectification itself isn't the problem.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

[Is that last bit a challenge? :tongue:]

No.

I have no intention of defending the porn industry. But the argument that women are "sucked into it" rings patently false. I cannot agree that the inducement of high wages for relatively short work is, in and of itself, "exploitation". At least in, say, the US/Western Europe, people are not drafted into porn service against their will.

Now, is it a particularly nasty industry in which to work? I have no actual knowledge, but I'd say, probably. So don't work in it. And don't watch it. And feel free to condemn anyone who does either.

As to the OP, (despite decades of research) my understanding of the female mind is limited. And I would thus defer to those who know.

Porn actors, of both sexes, are not the porn world equivalent of drug dealers. Your analogy was poor.

I never said that anyone was forced into working in porn. Another poster, sbat, postulated that women in the US could earn as much money as porn actresses in many fields. Considering what is required for a woman to work in porn (a cunt) and what is required for other jobs that pay as well I simply do not believe that to be the case.

As I said earlier, I don't watch porn any more. I don't work in porn, nor have I ever. I don't automatically condemn anyone who does work in porn. Those who profit the most and keep things how they are certainly have potential for being worthy of contempt - but I take people on a case by case basis. But I certainly don't condemn the actors.

Oh, and thanks for telling me what I am thinking/saying. I thought that was on the "NOT" list this week.

Well, what did you mean exactly then? What else could a drug dealer / porn actor analogy mean? Do educate me.

 

[Drifterwood]

Yes it does, because they're the objects of sexual desire. It's porn, the purpose is to arouse, which involves objectification. There's nothing inherently wrong with that.

If objectifying women causes a man to disrespect her, then it becomes harmful, but the objectification itself isn't the problem.

Wow, it took me hours to get through that site and you did it in minutes. Respect :tongue:

 

[B_subgirrl]

Yes it does, because they're the objects of sexual desire. It's porn, the purpose is to arouse, which involves objectification. There's nothing inherently wrong with that.

If objectifying women causes a man to disrespect her, or all of womankind, then it becomes harmful, but the objectification itself isn't the problem.

I'm agreeing with petite on this one.

 

[SilverTrain]

Porn actors, of both sexes, are not the porn world equivalent of drug dealers. Your analogy was poor.

I never said that anyone was forced into working in porn. Another poster, sbat, postulated that women in the US could earn as much money as porn actresses in many fields. Considering what is required for a woman to work in porn (a cunt) and what is required for other jobs that pay as well I simply do not believe that to be the case.

As I said earlier, I don't watch porn any more. I don't work in porn, nor have I ever. I don't automatically condemn anyone who does work in porn. Those who profit the most and keep things how they are certainly have potential for being worthy of contempt - but I take people on a case by case basis. But I certainly don't condemn the actors.



Well, what did you mean exactly then? What else could a drug dealer / porn actor analogy mean? Do educate me.

Hmm.

Question regarding the porn industry in the US:

What proportion of the female professionals have employment options providing equivalent income? If the proportion is fairly high - which I suspect it is - it would be more honest for Patch's anger to be directed, not at the consumers of this objectification, but at the willing participants who forgo self-respect to be objectified.

Then:

Are you serious?

Name me one other profession, aside from high end prostitution, where a person needs no education, no qualifications and no prior experience to make a three or four figure sum for a few hours work.

Then:

Dealing drugs. So blame the drug addicts when the poor dealer gets busted!

Seems to be a linear progession of subject matter and argument. But, have at the rhetorical arm-flapping.

 

[B_subgirrl]

Porn actors, of both sexes, are not the porn world equivalent of drug dealers. Your analogy was poor.

Maybe silver train meant to compare dealers with producers.

I think it's reasonable to compare producers of porn with drug dealers. In both cases participants themselves (actors or drug takers) have the final choice in whether or not they participate (most of the time at least).

 

[sbat]

In short, no. You really think pro-athletes make big money immediately with no prior expereince?

Yes. If you know anything about professional football (soccer), you would know that thousands of professional footballers are discovered yearly who have no other professional experience.

Same with actors. And models too - Djimon Haunsou was discovered on the streets

Ever heard of that 18 year old kid in Michigan who became mayor of his town? 18-year-old mayor taking his new job seriously - msnbc tv - Countdown with Keith Olbermann - msnbc.com

Don't even get me on singers who have immense raw talent that are discovered.

Believe it or not, there are actually a lot of career paths that don't require anything but good looks, luck, and someone to discover you

I suspect that there are some women for whom the cycle of poverty makes prostitution, stripping, and porn the best option that they have to make money. But there are thousands upon thousands of other girls with middle class backgrounds who have had access to decent public education growing up who do porn. When they burn out or their egos get crushed so much, they go (back) to college and get a degree and pursue a professional career.

Which begs the question - why are they doing porn if, through hard work and effort, they can get a career that pays out just as much over a lifetime? The same reason why anyone else goes for the rich quick schemes. It's fast and easy money.

Hence, my initial thought that perhaps Patch's anger is misplaced. Sure a lot of porn is exploitative. But barring the very poor for whom porn provides the best economic option, a big chunk of the women are only there out of ego (or lack of self-respect, or both). They have the option of working hard and making just as much money, but they forgo that option.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

sbat - you need to edit to make "Yes. If you know..." to "...to discover you" not look like I said it. There's answering post in quote but normally it involves a little more of the original quote. That's not me being a cunt - it's a suggestion - your post maybe confusing to people who are not me and do not know what I said.

And you really think those things happen as often as 'girl does porno'? And all the things you mention require some, as you say yourself, raw talent and / or considerable experience in the amateur circle of whatever (e.g. football) first. Or are you honestly trying to tell that kids with no football expereince whatsoever get picked off the streets and a week later are earning $1000 for a few hours work?

 

[dolfette]

a big chunk of the women are only there out of ego (or lack of self-respect, or both). They have the option of working hard and making just as much money, but they forgo that option.

i think they do work hard at an often emotionally and physically destructive job, with very little real regulation and protection. it's not an easy job.

 

[sbat]

sbat - you need to edit to make "Yes. If you know..." to "...to discover you" not look like I said it. There's answering post in quote but normally it involves a little more of the original quote. That's not me being a cunt - it's a suggestion - your post maybe confusing to people who are not me and do not know what I said.

And you really think those things happen as often as 'girl does porno'? And all the things you mention require some, as you say yourself, raw talent and / or considerable experience in the amateur circle of whatever (e.g. football) first. Or are you honestly trying to tell that kids with no football expereince whatsoever get picked off the streets and a week later are earning $1000 for a few hours work?

You're telling me that it is very common for virgins (of any sexual contact whatsoever) to go straight into porn?

 

[sbat]

i think they do work hard at an often emotionally and physically destructive job, with very little real regulation and protection. it's not an easy job.

You're right, it isn't. I meant working hard mentally (swotting/school work). But porn stars do hard work physically and take a psychological beating.

 

[dolfette]

You're right, it isn't. I meant working hard mentally (swotting/school work). But porn stars do hard work physically and take a psychological beating.

the percentage of porn actresses who came from unsupportive families and/or a history of physical/sexual abuse (both of which can severely effect confidence in an individuals abilities and their ability to study, concentrate and complete school) would be roughly how much?

 

[earllogjam]

Some girls just aren't into doing girly shit with other girly girls.