Would I choose to be gay?

[dolf250]

I was talking with a fellow who I know recently (he is gay) and he asked the question “do you think that I would chose to be gay?” The question intrigued me and now I am thinking that the answer depends on what was meant by the question. If the question was “did I chose it” then I am not 100% certain. I am positive that there is a genetic factor, but also that it is sometimes partially environmental. I am not going to argue that one.

If the question was “WOULD I chose to be gay” then the answer may be yes. I know that there are hardships associated with being gay, but how many men would, if given the choice, at this point in their lives chose to be straight. If given the choice during high school I can see some people taking the option, but not as many as adults. By this point in my life things that I would have chose to change about myself in the past I am now content with. I would not change who I am at the core. It would be like offering a black woman the option of becoming a white male because our lives are supposedly easier. I do not think that you would have many takers.

Keeping in mind that the majority of the men on this board are very secure in who they are, I am wondering if you feel that MOST gay men would chose to be gay if given the choice. Would they trade in the hardships and broken relationships they have had because of their orientation and go back and live their lives as straight men? I am not talking about repressing feelings, but rather a complete magical change in who they are.

I thought that I would ask here so that if the conversation goes back in that direction I do not look like a dumb prick who nonchantley suggests that “yes, you likely would chose to be gay.”

 

[fortiesfun]

You ask this in a much more complicated way than I have seen in previous threads getting at somewhat the same point. While it is true that I would not exercise an option to change my orientation at this point in my life, I would choose to avoid the homophobia of the world in a second.

Like most gay/bi men, if you mean would I change my core identity as an adult, then, no. I've moved through the self-loathing to something like self-acceptance. But if you mean do I think it is worth it to live in such an extensively homophobic society and put up with the, literally, endless hassles of having this orientation, then I'd have to say "no." I would choose my sexuality but I would not actively choose to be disempowered and discriminated against. Who would?

I guess it depends, then, on whether you are asking a political question or a personal question. I think you get different answers to those.

 

[Lex]

While it is true that I would not exercise an option to change my orientation at this point in my life, I would choose to avoid the homophobia of the world in a second.

Like most gay/bi men, if you mean would I change my core identity as an adult, then, no. I've moved through the self-loathing to something like self-acceptance. ....

I would choose my sexuality but I would not actively choose to be disempowered and discriminated against. Who would?

Ditto. The same goes for being ethnically (visibly different) for me.

Well said, Doc.

 

[madame_zora]

In all honesty, a great deal of my dissatisfaction with my gender stems from the unequal treatment societally. Unlike the previous two posters, I would change my gender in a heartbeat, even if it meant changing the core of who I am.

Of course, like any healthy egomaniac, I believe the majority of what makes me "me" would come through anyway, but I doubt there's anyone alive who feels the benefits of "growing stronger" or "developing character" are a fair trade off at all for living a life of one less respected.

 

[hunGreek]

as others said, the question is very complex.
there are partial questions that i think put things in prospect..
do i like being discriminated: NO
do i feel that my life would be more sucessful if i licked pussy: NO
would i like to have a larger statistical sample when looking for a mate: YES
would i like to have assosciate with a gender that is the total negative of me: NO
would i like to have a less self-loathing adolescence: YES
would i like to have bad taste in clothes?: NO (ok ok.. that is just a joke)

i mean.. i dont mind being gay, i do mind that i live in a backwards society tho. and instead of changing myself, id prefer if they changed.

everyone, in some way or another belongs to some minority group, either religious, ethnic, financial, cultural, sexual, or something. its not bad, if everyone else doesnt behave like a dildo and tries to squash the minority...


did i make any sense? i think not... :S

 

[dudepiston]

You make perfect sense & I echo your sentiments precisely. Particularly when it comes to adolescence. Mine was screwed up royally and it's affecting me to this day (or I'm allowing it to affect me, not sure on that one) and....would I change now? Sure. Would I have preferred to be a statistically more 'normal' teenage boy? You bet. It would have made all the difference in the world to perception of happiness. But (and we KNEW there'd be a 'but')....my thinking is we're here on Earth to learn something and to grow, and so part of that process for me must mean I have to be who I am.

as others said, the question is very complex.
there are partial questions that i think put things in prospect..
do i like being discriminated: NO
do i feel that my life would be more sucessful if i licked pussy: NO
would i like to have a larger statistical sample when looking for a mate: YES
would i like to have assosciate with a gender that is the total negative of me: NO
would i like to have a less self-loathing adolescence: YES
would i like to have bad taste in clothes?: NO (ok ok.. that is just a joke)

i mean.. i dont mind being gay, i do mind that i live in a backwards society tho. and instead of changing myself, id prefer if they changed.

everyone, in some way or another belongs to some minority group, either religious, ethnic, financial, cultural, sexual, or something. its not bad, if everyone else doesnt behave like a dildo and tries to squash the minority...


did i make any sense? i think not... :S

 

[Dave NoCal]

Excellent responses, all. Another factor for me is that I regret having been in the position in which I find it very difficult to be "one of the guys." What I mean is that generally when I interact with straight men, I have an awareness of being different. They may not notice, but I do. Perhaps it would have been different if I had been more athletic as a youth.

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

For the longest time I wouldn't admit to myself who I was. I finally did and admitted it to very few others. If you gave me the "magic pill" at that point in my life, I would have taken it in a heartbeat. I've had serious relationships with women and then proceeded to have them with men. My family was awful at first, then feigned support. My uncle was devasted...he lived vicariously through me because he was always extremely nerdy and not terribly attractive. What a blow when he found out I wasn't going to pound pussy for his ego anymore. Bless him...he's done his level best to be supportive. Fast forward to present day...I no longer have problems with who I am. I've fully accepted it and am comfortable with it. Any problems arising from my sexual orientation belong to other people, not me.

Although I wouldn't take the "magic pill", I know many who would. Religious dogma and social stigma are the main culprits. I didn't choose to be this way any more than I chose to have blue eyes. I'm not someone who has absoultely no attraction towards women. If times were different, there's a good chance I would have gone ahead with the wedding and married my last girlfriend. I'd be living in the burbs with 2.5 kids and popping a boner every time Julio, my strapping young gardener strutted across my lawn...but that's neither here nor there.

 

[Lex]

... If times were different, there's a good chance I would have gone ahead with the wedding and married my last girlfriend. I'd be living in the burbs with 2.5 kids and popping a boner every time Julio, my strapping young gardener strutted across my lawn...but that's neither here nor there.

Welcome to my world.

 

[B_Think_Kink]

I totally agree with Zora, I just don't know how to explain why.

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

I totally agree with Zora, I just don't know how to explain why.

Because you want to have a cock and fuck guys in the ass?

 

[B_Think_Kink]

Because you want to have a cock and fuck guys in the ass?

I think it's deeper than that... maybe in five years from now when I no longer have contact with my friend...

 

[D_Elijah_MorganWood]

Welcome to my world.

I was close. Very close. The only thing that saved me was the fact that she 1. shut her legs and wouldn't let me fuck her anymore (said it hurt too much...after 2 years) and 2. she turned into a whiny little girl. I'd always enjoyed sex with her and she shared my sense of adventure and we got along great until the end. I thought all guys were secretly attracted to other guys and the ones who acted on it were gay. I had a lot to learn.

Lex, I tried so hard to monitor my every word, gesture, my walk, my friends, my hobbies, clothes...you get the idea. It was exhausting. I was constantly vigilent against anything gay creeping in so others could see. I lived in constant fear that they would. What I didn't realise was that the great deal of energy I put into keeping my dark side hidden was drawing attention to me. I was never genuine and people were trying hard to figure me out. The killers were that I was just a little too pretty (couldn't do anything about that) and I was really sensitive. I donned a Hayden Christensen-like snarl and needless to say I stayed guarded for a long time. Even after I got my first boyfriend, I stayed in the closet. My girlfriend still visited from time to time, she decided she wanted me back. I kept fucking her for a year after I decided to give this M4M thing a shot. This lead to a harrowing scene with her trying to run me over in Malibu. I've relayed this story here more than once. Moral of the story...all the limits I had, I placed on myself. Lex. I understand completely how you ended up in the place you did. (hugs)

 

[madame_zora]

I think it's deeper than that... maybe in five years from now when I no longer have contact with my friend...

I sincerely hope you don't put those kinds of time limits on yourself for understanding how you feel. If someone is blocking your self-awareness, I'd try to get out of that much sooner.

 

[B_Think_Kink]

I sincerely hope you don't put those kinds of time limits on yourself for understanding how you feel. If someone is blocking your self-awareness, I'd try to get out of that much sooner.

I'm in the process of it, but after 6 years of having a best friend, it's hard to let go even through the abuse..

 

[coveryerteeth]

Coming from a extremely repressed fundamentalist family in a very homogenous, conservative rural community, I was indoctrinated from birth, practically, to believe that it was a choice. We were taught (in my parents freaky little thumper church) that given enough will power and strength of character one could overcome the temptation to partake in any sinful act (including jerking-off, but my complete and utter failure to do that should have been my first clue that all that stuff was bunk). I first realized I desired men sexually when I was 14 and was in such denial that I wouldn't even entertain the thoughts. I'd immediately "change the channel" in my mind to something banal and unrelated to men in any way.

Where I was raised the rare few men who were too "obvious" to fly under the radar became pariahs. Every challenge to someone's manhood came in the form of, "Come on! Push! If you can't bench-press 200lbs, you'll end up a queer, like [the most obvious of the guys at our High School]!" I had no conception of any way for me to allow myself to be gay without it costing me my family, my friends or any chance at any kind of happy life at all. Part of my journey to acceptance led me to finally question that whole "country club cat with a trophy wife, ridiculously big house in the 'burbs, 2.5 kids, a dog, a white picket fence and his and hers Mercedes" life that "everybody" was "supposed' to want. Everyone seems to be such cookie-cutter copies of each other, in my hometown, that the idea that eveyone's happiness won't necessarily look like everyone else's was a hard concept for me to wrap my mind around.

So, I "chose" to be straight. I was wound up in it all so tightly that it wasn't until I'd left home, lived out in the world for four years and seen how wonderfully diverse and exciting life in larger, less conformist cities can be that I finally gave up on hiding from the truth.

If I'd been offered a magic pill, back then, that would have allowed me to find that cookie-cutter life fulfilling; allowed me have a closer relationship with my family and not despise the place I called home during my childhood (which in all other respects was about as Rockwellian as they come) for being so venemously inhospitable to people like me, I would have given everything I had for it.

But, now that I've become so fond of fucking hot dudes and sucking hard cock, I can't really imagine why anyone would want to be straight. :biggrin1:

 

[Lex]

... Lex. I understand completely how you ended up in the place you did. (hugs)

I have no regrets, handsome. Every decision I have made has led me to here and now and I am a happy man these days. I was meant to meet my wife and she was meant to help me discover and accept myself. I have 2 beautiful children and a loving best friend for the rest of my days. I am out to all our parents and most of our friends. I feel great!

 

[dannymawg]

I tried so hard to monitor my every word, gesture, my walk, my friends, my hobbies, clothes...you get the idea. It was exhausting. I was constantly vigilent against anything gay creeping in so others could see. I lived in constant fear that they would. What I didn't realise was that the great deal of energy I put into keeping my dark side hidden was drawing attention to me. I was never genuine and people were trying hard to figure me out.

I get home from work early today to read this, and have to echo it and say ouch. Ouch. My vanity wants to say that I didn't have to try too hard to hide it, but advancing age is proving otherwise. After all the crap I've endured in the last few years, my nerves/ego/id/self-esteem are shot.

This is exactly the same predicament I'm in. Except I never did the deed with women. I lied about it. A lot. And that will be revealed soon, and I don't know how to handle the reactions it will have.

I started my own thread about it, but have been in a holding pattern for the last few weeks, as I wanted to read/digest a couple coming out books before I rambled further. They are to arrive in the mail this week. I post more on the subject when I have something more worthwhile to say, but again, wanted to echo this and say my heart goes out to you, Sorcerer.

 

[Ethyl]

In all honesty, a great deal of my dissatisfaction with my gender stems from the unequal treatment societally. Unlike the previous two posters, I would change my gender in a heartbeat, even if it meant changing the core of who I am.

I remember talking to my girlfriends about this back in high school and I was the only one in a group of 5 who decided I wouldn't change my gender because I thought it would mean I would lose the parts of myself I did like then. They didn't care. They wanted the benefits that came with simply being a man.

Of course, like any healthy egomaniac, I believe the majority of what makes me "me" would come through anyway, but I doubt there's anyone alive who feels the benefits of "growing stronger" or "developing character" are a fair trade off at all for living a life of one less respected.

I'd like to think that too but there's no way for me to know whether or not that would be true for me. Environment plays a strong enough role in our development that I wonder how different I would be if I were a man and how my parents, friends, teachers, mentors would have interacted with me. Not to mention the expectations or lack thereof. Maybe i'm just stubborn or retarded but I suspect certain aspects, many of which I like, would not be present if I were a man. I would miss those things about myself. But...'tis all speculation in the end, I suppose.

 

[fortiesfun]

I would change my gender in a heartbeat, even if it meant changing the core of who I am.

I doubt there's anyone alive who feels the benefits of "growing stronger" or "developing character" are a fair trade off at all for living a life of one less respected.

I hope this astonishingly honest, and frankly, surprising response does not get lost in this thread because it comes from a gender (rather than orientation) perspective. Zora's response is amazing in that it offers to change what we would think was the most defining thing about her without coming off in the slightest as self-hating. Somehow I can't imagine a gay man being able to make the same declaration without seeming not only politically incorrect, but callow. It is interesting though, to hear such blatant unmasking of male privilege. She's made me rethink my earlier response because of the sheer audacity of hers!

I wonder if I would still be "me," even if I was straight.