Would you step on the American flag?

[marleyisalegend]

http://www.tjcenter.org/ArtOnTrial/flag.html

The idea of the showcase on the left side of the page of the above link is that you have to step on the American flag in order to sign the book. The "controversy" is that many people believe it's treasonous or disrespectful or un-American or un-patriotic to step on an American flag or even display it at the wrong angle. The idea is that some people believe it would be unpatriotic to sign the book.

The flag in the pic is American but people from other countries can simply imagine the same scenario with their flag.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

I don't know of many other countries that treat their flags with the same reverence that the USA does.

I'd have no problem standing on an Irish flag. Wouldn't think twice about walking across one, standing on one - ditto the European flag. It is an image, an emblem - if it is a rug or part of a design on a floor I will treat it like any other part of the floor. When someone uses the tricolour as a rug I don't find it disrespectful.

I get it that it is different for you guys. It isn't a sentiment that is universal though.

 

[marleyisalegend]

I don't know of many other countries that treat their flags with the same reverence that the USA does.

Kudos to Manlybanisters for having some balls! Here's the way I feel about it. Americans seem to value clothe (that can be washed and dried) more than they value people. We WOULDN'T step on the flag but many of us would step on a homeless person to sign the book. I say this because many people step over homeless people on a daily basis and don't consider the lack of hospitality to be un-American but, oh no, you'd better not step on the flag.

I think people refusing to sign the book is a picture-perfect representation of the backwards priotizing that happens everyday in American life.

 

[killerb]

naw I wouldn't step on it or burn it or anything like that...

although I have major problems with some of this country's policies & behavior from its inception to present day, it's still my home...

 

[ManlyBanisters]

Dude - sorry to disagree - but I think if there was a person sitting in the same place as the flag in that picture people would be even less inclined to sign the book. Not because of any respect, you understand, but because they wouldn't want the proximity with a stranger.

Me? I'd give him $5 to shuffle to the left a bit :wink:

 

[ManlyBanisters]

naw I wouldn't step on it or burn it or anything like that...

Would you piss on it to put it out if it were on fire?

 

[marleyisalegend]

naw I wouldn't step on it or burn it or anything like that...

Well burning wasn't really part of the equation. Don't you feel like it's just a piece of fabric? If you scuff it with your shoes, it can be washed and dried. If the stains can't be removed, there are tens of thousands more in circulation.

Thanks for your honesty though.

 

[D_one and done]

Would you piss on it to put it out if it were on fire?

:lmao:

 

[No_Strings]

I don't know of many other countries that treat their flags with the same reverence that the USA does.

Ditto. I find it bizarre.
The only other countries I can think of who regard their national flag in such a manner are middle eastern.


I see a flag as a symbol and nothing more, and wouldn't hesitate to walk on the St. George's Cross.

Solely from a design point of view, most flags are hideous; the Stars and Stripes being a stunning example of this.

 

[marleyisalegend]

Dude - sorry to disagree - but I think if there was a person sitting in the same place as the flag in that picture people would be even less inclined to sign the book. Not because of any respect, you understand, but because they wouldn't want the proximity with a stranger.

LOL, I wasn't being literal, I didn't mean they'd actually step on a homeless person, just that a homeless person's life has less value than the American flag. Kudos to you though for your generocity.

 

[killerb]

Would you piss on it to put it out if it were on fire?

LOL - naw, I'd be too afraid of catching a spark in my pubes! :jumping38:

 

[killerb]

Well burning wasn't really part of the equation. Don't you feel like it's just a piece of fabric? If you scuff it with your shoes, it can be washed and dried. If the stains can't be removed, there are tens of thousands more in circulation.

Thanks for your honesty though.

let me clarify: true, a flag is a piece of fabric, however some pieces of fabric can be very important to some people...I only meant that I wouldn't go out of my way to step on it...but I'm also the guy who wouldn't walk across someone else's blanket that's laid out in the park or on the beach...

 

[B_Nick4444]

sign of disrespect

like using the "N" word

 

[invisibleman]

Art on Trial: Desecrating the American Flag or Other Revered Objects

The idea of the showcase on the left side of the page of the above link is that you have to step on the American flag in order to sign the book. The "controversy" is that many people believe it's treasonous or disrespectful or un-American or un-patriotic to step on an American flag or even display it at the wrong angle. The idea is that some people believe it would be unpatriotic to sign the book.

The flag in the pic is American but people from other countries can simply imagine the same scenario with their flag.

Personally, I would never step on the American flag (or any other country's flag) like a floor mat. That is disrespectful. I would wear a shirt made from weathered American flags though. (I wouldn't wear socks, pants or underwear made from American flags.)

 

[D_alex8]

Of course, context is everything. I couldn't personally get worked up in the least over something which, like this art project, is merely an academic exercise, deliberately questioning the veneration of the national flag as a kind of pseudo-religious icon. Only those who considered the student art project as symptomatic of a more widespread decline or perceived 'over-liberalisation' of academia and the arts would be likely to respond with the sheer degree of ferocity shown in this case.

However, a symbol's potency is what you make of it, and flag-sullying (or symbol-sullying in general), when used as one of the tools in a wider context of indoctrination, can prove a reasonably sinister and effective weapon.

When I was growing up in North Africa, it was a fairly regular event to have to step on the Israeli flag to get into the school building, or even to throw bottles of fake blood on it. In other words: if you wanted an education, you had to do it (under the watchful gaze of school monitors); if you didn't, you'd be ostracized or even outright punished. And all this within a context where Xeroxed images of corpses from Israeli attacks were constantly on display on school walls, and where the use of the word 'Israel' (as opposed to the sanctioned term, 'the Zionist Entity') out loud would be enough to get you expelled... and the flag-sullying obviously served as part of a larger purpose of intentionally radicalising the worldview of under-16s.

But there's a world of difference between an art installation in Chicago which is intended to provoke discussion, and the deliberate manipulation of children's minds which is intended to plant the seeds of hatred.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

Interesting perspective - but that is sullying another nation's flag - not your own. Therefore quite different, wouldn't you say.

I have seen similar examples of defacing 'the other side's' flag in the 6 counties and the boarder counties of the Republic too.

 

[snobbes]

In every single country in the world stepping on the flag is regarded as one of the most disrespectful acts you can do.
In the pics I have to say that it looks like a carpet with made to look like a flag. Then Id regard it as a carpet not a flag. If its a flag I would say its unthinkable that anyone would even consider stepping on it. if not to provoke.

 

[No_Strings]

In every single country in the world stepping on the flag is regarded as one of the most disrespectful acts you can do.

Source?

 

[ManlyBanisters]

In every single country in the world stepping on the flag is regarded as one of the most disrespectful acts you can do.

Looks like No_Strings and I are extraterrestrials then - that probably won't come as a surprise to some... :alien:

I don't know of many other countries that treat their flags with the same reverence that the USA does.

I'd have no problem standing on an Irish flag. Wouldn't think twice about walking across one, standing on one - ditto the European flag. It is an image, an emblem - if it is a rug or part of a design on a floor I will treat it like any other part of the floor. When someone uses the tricolour as a rug I don't find it disrespectful.

I get it that it is different for you guys. It isn't a sentiment that is universal though.

Ditto. I find it bizarre.
The only other countries I can think of who regard their national flag in such a manner are middle eastern.


I see a flag as a symbol and nothing more, and wouldn't hesitate to walk on the St. George's Cross.

 

[No_Strings]

Looks like No_Strings and I are extraterrestrials then - that probably won't come as a surprise to some... :alien:

What are you doing? John Lithgow will report us! :frown1: