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Discussion in 'Relationships, Discrimination, and Jealousy' started by studboysouth, Nov 12, 2004.
Thanks for everyone's advice.
I believe you answered your own question when you said....this friendship is hard work...........no friendship should be this difficult. Also your assessment of his character was right on when you mentioned that he is irresponsible and feels he is entitled to everything in life. At some point he will get into a situation that Mommy and friends are unable to extricate him from.
I would recommend that you begin backing off from this friendship before you become his "enabler" like his gf and mom have become. Enablers are just as much at fault as the person doing the action.........because they help people travel down the road that is not good for them.........they generally behave this way because they do not want to lose that person's love, respect, or friendship. From what you wrote you obviously love him and will do anything for him, including dragging yourself down with him. You need to wean yourself from this relationship very soon and you should begin immediately. Many times when one like yourself does that it helps to bring people like him around and away from their destructive behavior. You should be honest with him by telling him that you love him, his friendship, but you dislike his behavior very much. If he is a true friend he will listen and he will act and begin to change, otherwise he will eventually crash and burn as so many others have before him. 1st rule of friendship is to remain true to yourself and you will be able to be true to those you love.
Sound advice from Brad and I second it. That's the one thing you have to hate in situations like this. Until your friend realizes how much shit he can get into by making poor decisions, so long as his mother and his girlfriend keep bailing him out and feeding his behavior, he'll never learn. Even the cognitivists would throw in the towel. He seems unable to fully rationalize and understand his own behaviors because he has no sense of consequence driving him toward better decisions.
All you can do as his friend is say your peace. "Look, man, love you like none other, but I can't keep telling you what to do and bailing you out of trouble. I feel stuck and I'm going to start turning resentful if I feel like you won't listen to me. For the sake of our friendship, I don't mind being buds, but I'm going to just let you figure out stuff like this on your own."
Thanks guys. That sounds like good advice. I appreciate it.
You probably won't like my reply, but you did ask. I present this as my opinion, not as fact. You describe yourself as '90% heterosexual, 10% homosexual'. Reading the second paragraph of your post, it seems like that 10% is kicking in. You are in love with the dude. You described your relationship with your friend in terms that seem more applicable to a lover relationship. And it is entirely possible that you have a romantic interest in him without even realising it, or admitting it to yourself. Even if this is not the case, it comes across that way, and it's likely that your friend interprets it the same way. If he's straight and wants to maintain a strictly platonic relationship, it seems reasonable that he would not put himself in a situation where the two of you are sleeping under the same roof. Making up excuses is a lot easier than coming out with the real reason if that reason can be construed as an accusation. Some will undoubtedly say that I'm full of shit on this, and that I just assume that everyone is a potential ass pirate, but that's not the case. Concerning this scenario, I speak from personal experience, and have seen it happen to friends of mine as well. Regardless of my interpretation of the nature of the friendship, and apart from the fact that he lied about the driver's license thing, you are fostering a destructive relationship. I read your other post regarding your friendship. You stress that he values your friendship, yet he continues to do things that suggest otherwise. He doesn't respect or appreciate what you're trying to do for him. He fights it every step of the way. He obviously has no intention of changing. Ask yourself this: do you have the patience and determination to put up with a lifetime of this? Do you have a martyr complex? Friendship is supposed to be give-and-take. That's not what you describe. How long can you continue to give before you're completely drained? Only you know the answers. If you decide to move forward in this relationship, good luck; you'll need that and more.
DMW, thats exactly what I thought when I was reading it.
What you described there definetley goes beyond friendship IMO.
The more I thought about DMW's reply the more plausible it became as an explanation and certainly worth sbs' consideration as a possibility. When I read constructive advice posted so far on this issue I appreciate how fortunate I am to be a member of this group.
DMW, thanks for your reply.
Maybe a little bit more would help you understand.
My friend stays over all the time. He stayed over last night. As a matter of fact, this is his second home. So it isn't a matter that he doesn't want to stay over. Also, he wasn't lying about the DL thing. He was being honest. At first I used to think he would lie alot, but I've learned over time he is telling the truth. He is really extremely careless and forgetful. He's getting better, but he's still bad about keeping up with his stuff.
Secondly, yes, there is a lot of love here. It is mutual. We've talked about it before. Every day that passes by, more of it is expressed. And to be honest with you, our relationship does go beyond the normal male-male relationship. I won't give it all away, but let's just say that we are very close and comfortable with each other.
And yes, you are right. That 10% does kick in from time to time. Just last night we were discussing this. He has never openly admitted his 10%, but let's just say he has a 10% as well (actually, more than 10%).
He's told me on several occasions that he does appreciate me. And I've come to realize that he does. But like today, for example, his girlfriend called him and gave him grief that he was still at my place this morning and hadn't gone home yet. This girl runs him like he is her puppy. She uses fear to control him. She basically suked him in with gifts and sex, now she uses that to keep him coming back. When she asked him why he was still hanging out with me, instead of telling her "because this is my friend...I don't need an excuse.." he tried to justify why he was still hanging out here. When I asked him about it, he said he thought it was strange, but that she didn't mean anything by it. This girl doesn't like me because she sees me as a threat to her control over him. She knows that when we go out, we get a LOT of attention from girls. She knows that I also challenge him to mature and be more critical of her spoiled and childish behavior.
My friend has no male direction in his life. He has always had a woman telling him what to do. He's always been taken care of by a woman. He isn't an independent man. As a matter of fact, I am the first long-lasting male relationship he has had.
Given this info, any additional insight?
It seems as if you are being drawn increasingly into a very unhealthy and codependent relationship.You also seem to be a person with a big heart and a lot to give. However you, your friend, his mother and his girlfriend just might have some boundary issues that you need to work out.People do not usually change their bad behavior as long as there is some long suffering relative, friend or lover to pick up the slack. He needs to feel the consequences of his actions. I dont know whether he is suffering from Bi polar disorder or is possibly a naricissist, but it seem as though he is heading for a crash course and you are in the vehicle. Back the car slowly out of the parking place and drive away. He needs to feel the burn and you dont need to get burned. Just my two cents worth.
Totally agree with DMW. In fact, I would say that this sounds like a bittersweet seduction between two guys who have managed everything but the fucking.
I have been there and don't envy you, but must tell you that there us something simultaneaously painful and lovely about your relationship. I suspect that there is more real passion in it than the one with his girlfriend.
You're not a conciously "acceptable" sexual partner, so things get complicated for you both (like a pissed off girlfriend calling to bitch about him sleeping at your place and not her's).
Been there. It's alot of work.
Sexual intimacy with the person that you really love is ultimately more satisfying than where you are at this moment in your life. At the risk of sounding crude, if you could set guilt and cultural prohibitions aside you might just fuck each other's brains out...............
Ooopppss, that might have been too forward....but I don't think that it is very far off the mark.........................................................