You're doing a heckuva job, Georgie

[earllogjam]

Bring it, bitch. You guys don't have the balls.

We've already infiltrated your country with our insideous popular culture. What more is there to do?

 

[SpeedoGuy]

And on the other hand, the Bushies also want us to believe in the existence of a credible, imminent threat to the USA, in the hopes that we'll go along with escalations to the "war on terror", presumably so it can save our naive, shortsighted asses.

Terrorists and insurgents infiltrating and stirring up trouble? No problem. We have a president who knows how to deal with threats like that. He'll appear on TV smirking and cockily boasting "Bring 'em on!"

It sure worked in Iraq.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

One wonders how things would have turned out if the focus had remained on Afghanistan 5 years ago, rather than shifting to Iraq as it did. As it stands, it looks a lot like thousands of lives and billions of dollars for pretty much no good reason.

If the focus had stayed on Afghanistan? - It would've been the same thing in the long run, only worse - see the Russians before and the British before that. Afghanistan is notoriously difficult to really control (they barely have a lid on Kabul even now) - probably one of the reasons they wanted to change focus. That and the fact that Afghanisitan is more about trade routes (well pipelines) and warm sea-port access* than actual oil. Maybe they weren't ready to play hardball with the Russians again so soon?

I'm just as curious to see what happens when they eventually try to stretch themselves to Iran. Of course the Russians have a massive vested interest there too. Can you say 'World War III'?

When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains,
And the women come out to cut up what remains,
Jest roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
An' go to your Gawd like a soldier.
(Kippling)​

*Yes, I know it is landlocked - it is still a route, what with the surrounding geographical factors.​

 

[B_NineInchCock_160IQ]

You know...this Middle East Iraq trouble would just come to an end if we just annex Canada. With the second largest oil reserves in the world our troubles would be over for the next 30 years or so. What do you say Rob? Hell, we share the same language, culture and what's wrong with being the 51st state anyways? You have the oil, we need it. Besides we have to do something with all the billions we have poured into weapons research and development. Why not use some friendly intimidation. What a perfect union.:tongue:

From memory, I thought Saudi Arabia was #1, Russia was #2, Iran was #3, Iraq #4.... Canada much further down the list. Are you talking strictly about untapped reserves?

[edit] this map puts Canada 20th..
The Oil World Map

 

[B_NineInchCock_160IQ]

Bring it, bitch. You guys don't have the balls.

oh ho ho.... you just wait until G W figures out where Canada is on a map. THEN you'll be sorry.

 

[DC_DEEP]

What do you say Rob? Hell, we share the same language, culture and what's wrong with being the 51st state anyways? You have the oil, we need it. Besides we have to do something with all the billions we have poured into weapons research and development. Why not use some friendly intimidation. What a perfect union.:tongue:

La même langue ? Que diriez-vous de la PQ? Demandez à les gendarmes de langue si c'est vrai!

 

[rob_just_rob]

If the focus had stayed on Afghanistan? - It would've been the same thing in the long run, only worse - see the Russians before and the British before that. Afghanistan is notoriously difficult to really control (they barely have a lid on Kabul even now) - probably one of the reasons they wanted to change focus. That and the fact that Afghanisitan is more about trade routes (well pipelines) and warm sea-port access* than actual oil. Maybe they weren't ready to play hardball with the Russians again so soon?

I'm just as curious to see what happens when they eventually try to stretch themselves to Iran. Of course the Russians have a massive vested interest there too. Can you say 'World War III'?

When you're wounded and left on Afghanistan's plains,
And the women come out to cut up what remains,
Jest roll to your rifle and blow out your brains
An' go to your Gawd like a soldier.
(Kippling)​

*Yes, I know it is landlocked - it is still a route, what with the surrounding geographical factors.​

I'm aware of the track record for Afghanistan's past occupiers. I would have thought, though, that if the USA occupied Afghanistan with the purpose of catching/killing bin Laden and his high-level supporters, they'd have put a little more effort into it.

As of this time the NATO forces in Afghanistan number about 30,000. There are 150,000 troops (mostly US) in Iraq, where bin Laden isn't and never was.

 

[B_NineInchCock_160IQ]

We're fighting the terrorists in Iraq so we don't have to fight them in Afghanistan.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

I'm aware of the track record for Afghanistan's past occupiers. I would have thought, though, that if the USA occupied Afghanistan with the purpose of catching/killing bin Laden and his high-level supporters, they'd have put a little more effort into it.

As of this time the NATO forces in Afghanistan number about 30,000. There are 150,000 troops (mostly US) in Iraq, where bin Laden isn't and never was.

They aren't in the least bit intereseted in catching Bin Laden - if they wanted him caught / dead he would be caught / dead.

Keeping Bin Laden out there as PE #1 suits the PNAC boys and their buddies just fine because there is a 'tangible' threat that requires VAST funding to 'fight'. If Bin Laden was gone then the US population might relax enough to notice that there isn't actually that big a threat at all! Look at the IRA mainland campaigns through the 70s and 80s - constant threat, constant attacks - bombs going off, bombs found, shootings, beatings - constant - what has happened in America since the WTC / Pentagon attacks? Nothing. There is no concerted campaign, there is nothing to be afraid of on an on-going basis.

The US army were not kept at a high level in Afghanistan because the US had to get Iraq before they could think about taking Iran. Because that is where they are going. Without a shadow of a doubt.

 

[ManlyBanisters]

We're fighting the terrorists in Iraq so we don't have to fight them in Afghanistan.

Bull shit. You're in Iraq for the oil and as a jumping off point to Iran and the Brits are there cos that is what the Saudis wanted.

Oh - and you will lose - but that is by-the-by.

 

[rob_just_rob]

They aren't in the least bit intereseted in catching Bin Laden - if they wanted him caught / dead he would be caught / dead.

Keeping Bin Laden out there as PE #1 suits the PNAC boys and their buddies just fine because there is a 'tangible' threat that requires VAST funding to 'fight'. If Bin Laden was gone then the US population might relax enough to notice that there isn't actually that big a threat at all! Look at the IRA mainland campaigns through the 70s and 80s - constant threat, constant attacks - bombs going off, bombs founds, shootings, beatings - constant - what has happened in America since the WTC / Pentagon attacks? Nothing. There is no concerted campaign, there is nothing to be afraid of on an on-going basis.

The US army were not kept at a high level in Afghanistan because the US had to get Iraq before they could think about taking Iran. Because that is where they are going. Without a shadow of a doubt.

You're almost as cynical as I am.

Osama bin Laden = Emmanuel Goldstein, definitely.

 

[Full_Phil]

You're so right. The only mystery here at all is why we aren't rioting in the streets. Oh yeah, that's because we'd have to unwedge our fat asses from the couch and possibly even WALK somewhere. bush, cheney, rove, rice- all owners of large chunks of stock in low tech industry are amassing wealth at absurd rates, and we really have to "wonder" what this war is all about? Good fucking god, I prefer flogging myself with a real whip than with the stupidity of my fellow Americans.

First of all, it IS about money, because money will be power until a helluva lot bigger cataclysm than the Democrats coming back to power occurs. Our fat asses, leadened by McDonald's and the constant hype to find gratification through indulgence, have grown much larger since the 60's & 70's when we actually worried about trees and the air and cancer and exercise and making a difference as a poulace and finding love and respect in religion as opposed to condemnation. We are a super power in name and in weapons stockpiles only as our currency and our principles (both stated and actual) have no real global value. We are proceeding like every major nation in recorded history into decline, and it's up to all of us whether we stay on the toboggan or jump off and play in the snow.

 

[B_NineInchCock_160IQ]

Bull shit. You're in Iraq for the oil and as a jumping off point to Iran and the Brits are there cos that is what the Saudis wanted.

Oh - and you will lose - but that is by-the-by.

I'm in Iraq?

FUCK.

No wonder I can't find anything to eat but falafels.

Wait... what is it I'm losing again?

 

[Mr. Snakey]

Dubya gonna leave washington with a sore ass from everyone kickin' it:biggrin1:

 

[D_Gunther Snotpole]

You know...this Middle East Iraq trouble would just come to an end if we just annex Canada. With the second largest oil reserves in the world our troubles would be over for the next 30 years or so.

From memory, I thought Saudi Arabia was #1, Russia was #2, Iran was #3, Iraq #4.... Canada much further down the list. Are you talking strictly about untapped reserves?

[edit] this map puts Canada 20th..
The Oil World Map

FROM WIKIPEDIA:
Alberta's estimated oil reserves was raised from total conventional oil reserves of around 5 gigabarrels (billion barrels) to the much larger figure of around 180 gigabarrels by the inclusion of the Athabasca Oil Sands deposit by the Alberta Energy and Utilities Board (AEUB),[1] placing Canada second only to Saudi Arabia.[2] Based on current developments, the AEUB estimates that by 2016 Alberta oil sands production will triple to amount to 86% of the province's total oil production, and Alberta will by then be one of the largest oil producers in the world.

To be sure, in a sense these reserves are untapped, in the sense that they are not currently being exploited. But they're so huge that you can't possibly tap them all at once.
They're there, they're identified, and ... with very bad luck, considering the ecological consequences ... they will in due time be exploited.

 

[B_NineInchCock_160IQ]

oh, good. That should lend another 5-10 years or so to the shelf-life of my favorite gas-guzzling toy... before the oil runs out and all hell breaks loose and we have to live in caves.

 

[D_Gunther Snotpole]

oh, good. That should lend another 5-10 years or so to the shelf-life of my favorite gas-guzzling toy... before the oil runs out and all hell breaks loose and we have to live in caves.

One can hope.

 

[earllogjam]

From memory, I thought Saudi Arabia was #1, Russia was #2, Iran was #3, Iraq #4.... Canada much further down the list. Are you talking strictly about untapped reserves?

[edit] this map puts Canada 20th..
The Oil World Map

Greatest Oil Reserves by Country, 2006 — Infoplease.com

Yes, untapped oil reserves. Canada is #2, a distant #2 to Saudi Arabia and the Middle East combined.

We are there for the oil. Period. How long did we stay in Somalia? Afganistan? Kosovo? all these places where we were supposed to protect "liberty"? Not 5 years for sure. We don't loose much pulling out of a place like Somalia other than some human rights points. But oil we can't live without. I don't think the US gets much oil from the Middle East but Europe and Japan do and all our economies are linked.

The implications of the world's largest oil reserves falling into control of non-friendly hands is unthinkable because the USA and the west's whole existance is based on free flowing plentiful oil. That's why we will be there for the long haul. Have you seen the embassy we are building in Bagdad? We are also probably there at the request of the Saudi Royal family who has us by the balls. A nation which the majority of the 9/11 attackers and Osama Bin Laden hailed from and is probably having it's own problems of malcontents ready to overthrow the family like they did the Shah of Iran. I won't even go into a nuclear capable Iran here.

What exit strategy can there be that would not destabilize the region any more and keep our oil interests in friendly hands? Not many now. That is why pulling out 100% is not an option for us - unless we find another plentiful supply of oil outside the region or change to a non-oil based economy. The problem will only become more acute as China's economy grows.

 

[madame_zora]

I'm in Iraq?

FUCK.

No wonder I can't find anything to eat but falafels.

Wait... what is it I'm losing again?

As long as it's not your erection!

We're fighting the terrorists in Iraq so we don't have to fight them in Afghanistan.

That almost made me pee my pants.

 

[earllogjam]

La même langue ? Que diriez-vous de la PQ? Demandez à les gendarmes de langue si c'est vrai!

OK, nous n'annexerons pas le Québec.