Steve Irwin; What a crock!

[MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK]

Is it just me, or is it becoming a media trend for celebs to place their very young children in danger? I mean that idiot Steve Irwin, AKA, The Crocodile Hunter sure didn't place that much value on his one month old child when he fed that croc with him in his other hand.

Then we got the asshole, and I'm glad I said that, ASSHOLE of celebs putting their kids in danger Michael, " I'd sooner slit my wrists before I'd hurt a child." Jackson. I'm telling you, these idiots need to go to parental classes, because something is severely wrong with them that they do this without care and/or concern for their offsprings well beings.

 

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mindseye: (Disclaimer: Crikey, I haven't actually seen the Steve Irwin footage.)

Eh, I think the media's blowing things out of proportion, because the vast mind-numb public eats it up when celebrities go bad. Here are some disjointed reactions -- I'm free-associating a bit here.

• The fact is, no actual harm came to the child. Irwin insists the baby wasn't in any danger. Various media pundits say the alligator could have snapped and bitten the baby. Who do you think knows more about alligator behavior?
• What if it were a dog instead of an alligator? Babies play near dogs all the time, and people think that it's cute. But a dog bite can be just as fatal to a baby. ("But dogs are domesticated and alligators are wild!" you reply? This alligator's been in captivity for a while now and, I'd bet, is pretty used to being fed by humans.)
• Why do celebrities who expose their children to alligators get lynched, but parents who expose their children to, say, cigarette smoke, highway travel, or cribs get off the hook? All of these are proven to be hazardous and risky to a degree -- but one's a lot more sensationalistic!
• In the long run, I think Steve Irwin is doing the right thing. He works around exotic animals, and they can be dangerous if handled improperly. Exposing the children to the danger while they're still very young and can be supervised will make them more receptive to learning how to be safe around them when they're old enough to start toddling around on their own. (This, by the way, is one of the theories behind so-called 'water baby' classes that get infants into swimming pools and underwater even though they are too young to be able to survive on their own underwater.)

 

[Pecker]

After trying his whole life to make another Croc Hunter out of his son, Irwin's luck will be to have raised a flaming Interior Decorator.

The year, 2024: "Tell me, Mr. Irwin, are you going to take over your dad's Croc business some day?"

"Of courth! He'th already agreed to let me redethign the whole thet! Let'th thee...we need lotuth blothomth in the pond, and thoth rockth, ugh! Out they go! Then we'll paint the tree houth........"

 

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Tender: ah but woe is me if someone sees me swat my toddler in the parking lot at walmart

Tender

 

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SpeedoGuy: Yikes! Here we go with Wal-Mart again!

SG

 

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jerkin4-10: mindseye...you need to see the footage BEFORE commenting...what any intelligent person would do...i HAVE seen the footage and what this guy did was absolutely inexcusable...with a chicken in one hand and his child under his arm...he was trying to get the croc to follow him...or look up...roll over or whatever...and made mike jackson look like a protective parent...jeez...i was in shock watching this idiot... its one thing to put your OWN life in danger, trusting the unpredictability of a WILD animal...but to put the life of a baby...he needs to have his parents license revoked...

 

[jonb]

Television has sunk to a new low. I think it's somewhere in the Earth's mantle now?

 

[MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK]

[quote author=jerkin4-10 link=board=99;num=1073321472;start=0#5 date=01/05/04 at 15:11:06]mindseye...you need to see the footage BEFORE commenting...what any intelligent person would do...i HAVE seen the footage and what this guy did was absolutely inexcusable...with a chicken in one hand and his child under his arm...he was trying to get the croc to follow him...or look up...roll over or whatever...and made mike jackson look like a protective parent...jeez...i was in shock watching this idiot... its one thing to put your OWN life in danger, trusting the unpredictability of a WILD animal...but to put the life of a baby...he needs to have his parents license revoked... [/quote]

You're damn right about that, jerkin.You know, if by himself Irwin wants to pull that crazy shit, more power to the crazy bastard, but we're talking about when he had a month old child for christ's sake! Plus, the fact that if he slipped, it would've meant a smorgasborg for the croc.

The man is an expert on handling crocodiles and the like, but let him do it minus junior, or at least til junior's a lot older and bigger than a mouthful for the croc.

 

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mindseye: [quote author=MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK link=board=99;num=1073321472;start=0#7 date=01/06/04 at 04:32:28] Plus, the fact that if he slipped, it would've meant a smorgasborg for the croc.

The man is an expert on handling crocodiles and the like, but let him do it minus junior, or at least til junior's a lot older and bigger than a mouthful for the croc.
[/quote]

Your logic here is flawed. If he had slipped, the results could have been traumatic regardless of whether or not a baby was present; but you've conceded that he's an expert on handling crocodiles.

Would you recommend that no one operate a motor vehicle with their child inside because -- even if they are expert drivers, if they slipped, the child could be harmed?

Accidents happen sometimes, but in fact, Steve Irwin has an excellent safety record -- not only does he have all of his limbs intact, but so do both of his children. I don't respect his choice to exploit his chidren on TV by involving them in front of the camera. However, I defer to his professional judgement about animal safety.

If Jack Hanna came out to criticize Irwin, I'd listen. Until then, I'm standing by my original remarks. He made a decision that the risk was low enough as to be negligible; he performed the feeding safely with no injuries; and people with no experience whatsoever around crocodiles are questioning his judgement.

 

[MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK]

CLUE TIME!!In the first place, a car or motorcycle can be controlled, but a crocodilian(That's crocodile to you!) cannot, irregardless of whether or not he has been in captivity and fed by hand.
His predatory instincts will kick in at the first sign of easy prey.

You really want to believe that bringing a baby into a pit full of crocs poses no danger to either the father or the baby?

Why don't you tell me that if it ever happens to you, huh?

And until anyone can conclusively tell me of otherwise, MY POST that I started will continue to remind people of this incident so that others might listen and learn.

 

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mindseye: [quote author=MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK link=board=99;num=1073321472;start=0#9 date=01/06/04 at 14:23:22]It the first place, a car or motorcycle can be controlled, but a crocodilian(That's crocodile to you!) cannot, irregardless of whether or not he has been in captivity and fed by hand. His predatory instincts will kick in at the first sign of easy prey.
[/quote]

And what are your qualifications that entitles you to determine that a crocodile cannot be controlled?

I say it's far easier for a person with adequate training to be able to influence the behavior of a crocodile than to influence the behavior of other drivers on the highway. (And indeed, if Steve Irwin were careening down the F3 waving his baby out the window, I'd be totally on your side!)

You're familiar with cars, and you're comfortable saying that they "can be controlled", and you'd think nothing of going on a road trip with your infant child in tow. Perhaps if you were equally comfortable with crocodiles in general, and with that particular crocodile in specific, you'd be more understanding of what risks are involved and how to avoid and defend against them.

But you're not. Keep your clue; I think you need it more than I do.

 

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jerkin4-10: jeez mindseye...chuck is right there...control a croc??? dude...i dont care WHO you are, HOW you've been trained or WHAT your deal is...even trained professionals have slip ups...did you see the guy with his head in the crocs mouth?...TRAINED professional...with his head stuck in a crocs or gators mouth....GET A CLUE...thats why they call em WILD animals...

 

[Pecker]

Um...Roy Horn might have something to say about controlling wild animals.

But he can only use hand signals for the time being.

 

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jerkin4-10: nice one pecker...had almost forgotten about ole roy...

 

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mindseye: [quote author=jerkin4-10 link=board=99;num=1073321472;start=0#11 date=01/06/04 at 15:38:40]even trained professionals have slip ups[/quote]


And trained drivers sometimes have fatal car crashes.

What neither you nor MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK has established is that the risk that Steve Irwin undertook is measurably greater than other risks that parents expose their children to -- for example, driving with an infant in the car.

I'm not saying that there's no risk involved. Obviously, there's a risk. But neither you nor I is sufficiently qualified to make the determination of how high that risk is. I will continue to trust the judgement of an animal professional over that of an internet yokel.

Sadly, it's also obvious that this thread's no longer moving forward. Unless someone can come forth with documentation, data, statistics -- something concrete about the risks of feeding alligators, instead of their uninformed and unskilled opinions, or a citation to the testimony of an expert in the area, I'll move on.

 

[MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK]

Evidence that sometimes even the most trained of professionals can be attacked has never been proven more in the last few months than with that tiger trainer... DAMN! I forgot his name, but you get the picture. And, I might add, the tiger that attacked him was raised by him too.

So going on for the 3rd time, Mindseye, wild animals like crocs and tigers are unpredictable, and I wouldn't bring my kid in with me if I trained them.

By the way, what makes you think you know more about animal behavior than me? What, do you have you a degree in zoology or something?

Oh, incidently, Mindseye, I'm hardly a yokel; I live an hr away from New York City.

 

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jerkin4-10: the point is DILDO...you dont risk a small childs life for the sake of a publicity stunt...and chuck nor I are yokels...but you ARE a stubborn JACK-ASS for not recognizing an un-necessary risk to a childs life AND commenting on a subject you have NO knowlege about...you said yourself...'i havent seen the footage', with each response you show what a goofball you are...
i see no one defending the guy...NO ONE...and the proof will be when here in a few minutes when jack hanna comments on larry king live...good grief...BUY a clue...

 

[MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK]

All this and yet you still adamantly think that Steve Irwin was justified in taking his kid in like that, Mindseye? ???

Just what kind of mental retardation is that anyway, huh? What, you need to go and talk to Roy Horn ,and get the entire picture on wild animals? Because that's one guy who's learned about them in spades.

I wouldn't give a shit one less bit if Jack Hanna came out croc in hand and said they're harmless. The fact remains---and still remains that crocodiles are predatory animals, and nothing can stop that instinct if presented with a possible opportunity like that.

 

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Captin_hung: i've meet steve irwin in real life i went to see one of his shows and id have to say that if i was going to get in a croc pen i would want to have that guy with me in their(i didnt mean it in that way get your mind out of the gutter)

 

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gigantikok: I know I can't really add anything to this thread or advance it forward, but in my opinion, mindseye is making the most sense to me. Who are you people to say how a croc will or won't behave? This man we are talking about has spent his whole fucking life around crocodiles, I'm sure he can anticipate their every move, right down to a moment prior to when they may possibly "snap", as you say. You don't know shit about animals, Steve Irwin was been handling them for years and has of yet to run into any fatal danger. I'm sure if animals were so likely to just "snap" at the sight of food i.e. the baby (which is ridiculous to suggest anyway, since the crocodile was probably being well fed... and because I am not so sure how tasty crocodiles consider babies. Jesus, most crocodiles BITE people, not EAT them) then Irwin and his family would be missing many more limbs. So people, stop talking out your ass because you are looking for a new topic to bitch and moan about. Life is full of risks, but this man is a trained profession, you are not, so who are you to sit on your asses and judge him?

Oh, and lay off Michael.