I love how Victor had the issue of too gay/not gay enough, and people are harping on how he's not gay enough
Michael Cimino (actor)
- Thread starter xHeartlessx
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I’ve said something similar too and while I do enjoy the show, Victor is the most boring part of it (unfortunately). It’s all down to the writing and literally all the other characters are more interesting to watch and the straight couples are also written better. I feel this is the same situation I feel towards tarlos in 911 lone star. They’re just there with no depth
Benji also doesn’t even feel like a real character bc he has no purpose outside of his relationship with victor. Literally all his scenes are with victor or about victor.
That’s so true about Benji. I’ve never understood the Victor-Benji shippers because I feel like I barely even know Benji. (And from what I do know, they seem honestly kind of toxic together.)
AllTheColorsOfTheWind
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This. So. Much. This.
I know it's a show but damn that is not a healthy relationship at all.
Filmguy001
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To be fair, the show did them an injustice by not showing the 10 weeks of happiness they had before they hit some bumps.
Actually, each season covers roughly 6 months of Victor's life > so Season 3 will include his 17th b-day and the Junior Prom finale where he'll definitely be back together with Benji and Rahim will have his own boyfriend storyline > because recent polls confirm that 80%+ of fans want "Venji" > and Disney/Hulu + Producers bottom-line is Ratings / Renewals / Spin-offs / PROFITS > achieved by giving fans what they want and expect > HOLLYWOOD IS A BOTTOM-LINE BUSINESS!
You raise some great points here! "Philadelphia", "The Birdcage", Brokeback Mountain" would likely never have been financed, produced, and watched by a large global audience without the various major "straight" stars involvement! That said, "Love, Victor" is a lower budget 10-episode streamer featuring a younger cast of relative unknowns > so not sure why an actual talented gay actor couldn't have been cast as Victor at the very least?
Completely agree with you! Producers and writers went from showing "Venji" as unrealistically perfectly happy, to then sabotaging their relationship with a tsunami of overly contrived, relentlessly dramatic EXTERNAL obstacles which few long-term adult couples could withstand! Hopefully next season, they'll strike a more realistic balance! Way too many ridiculous, lazily written, non-sensical and annoying "love triangles", especially involving Victor and veritable stranger newbie Rahim!
Gotta say though that regardless of who is in charge, Hollywood projects require investors who are often highly risk averse in their desire to hopefully realize a return on their investment. Casting choices, especially on larger budget projects often reflect this bottom-line business reality of what Hollywood produces and the reluctance to cast openly gay actors in leading roles. There is no shortage of gay studio executives, producers, directors who have to deal with these ever-present economic and investor "Art vs Commerce" realities which have always existed since the beginning of Hollywood
They made similar promises about having gay writers on the team, but wouldn't provide even any broad numbers. Yes, there are gay writers on the show, but I've also read in multiple media articles that most of the writing team is straight!
VICTOR IS AT RAHIM'S DOOR > WHY?
1/ Victor & Benji always say "HEY", not "Hi" to each other, especially during "serious" discussions
2/ Benji is justifiably angry > Victor would be using a more contrite "can we please talk" tone of voice
3/ Rahim's door is the less predictable, surprise opening scene to freak our the largely disapproving fanbase
4/ BUT Victor isn't there to "choose" Rahim > He's there to tell him he still loves and is committed to Benji {Large majority of fans LOVE the Rahim character, but NOT if he's the unwelcome interloper who breaks up Venji. Both Victor and Rahim's popularity has taken a hit with this overly sudden, non-sensical "love triangle" storyline, which needs to be repaired asap so that Rahim can have his own independent romantic storyline with the required love, support, and enthusiasm of the global fanbase)
5/ Victor and Rahim work better as good friends > And having Victor suddenly fall in love with the FIRST new gay dude he meets is lame, cliched, and lazy script-writing from a talented team capable of far better storyline development!
BETTER QUESTION IS WHY WOULD BENJI STILL "CHOOSE" TO DATE TRUST-BREAKER, SERIAL KISSER VICTOR? {Most of the tsunami of EXTERNAL obstacles thrown at Venji's relationship by the writers have mostly been from Victor's side in dealing with his "coming out" drama! What happened to the sweet, thoughtful and "romantic" Victor of season 1 who Benji understandably fell for, minus all of his season 2 self-centered, sad-sack "coming out" drama?)
VICTOR ENDS UP WITH BENJI BY THE END OF SEASON 3 > WHY?
1/ Disney/Hulu + Producers bottom-line biz objectives are Ratings / Renewals / Spin-offs / PROFITS > achieved by giving viewers what they want and expect to see > And recent polls confirm 75% of fans want endgame Venji! (ALWAYS REMEMBER FOLKS THAT HOLLYWOOD IS A BOTTOM-LINE $$$ BUSINESS!)
2/ Viewers have invested 2 full seasons watching the carefully written and developed Venji relationship. Producers spent months casting both characters for their superb chemistry > Season 2 billboards featured Venji together prominently. They aren't going to toss this relationship away so easily from both a creative and BUSINESS $$ perspective!
3/ IF Victor's heart can so easily be swayed by veritable stranger newbie Rahim vs his first love / first sex Benji after 2 full seasons of relationship growth > WHY would viewers continue to invest their time following his his next "big romance"?
4/ It makes zero sense that Victor would close his eyes and be able to clearly see Rahim as the partner he's beaten the odds with in future since they've only hung out together as friends a few times vs 2 full seasons of romantic "firsts" with Benji
5/ Fans understand there needs to be "drama" in any teen series, but they also want and expect Venji's relationship to be given a fair-minded chance to be successful vs the overly contrived avalanche of "drama" thrown at it during season 2!
NOTE TO IDIOT PRODUCERS AND THEIR WRITING TEAM:
IF you're going to make the fanbase wait ONE entire year before addressing yet another "cliffhanger" ending, then at least make it as upbeat, exciting, relatable and endlessly watchable as the season 1 cliffhanger, which was also a logical extension of the first season storyline!
The annoying, overly sudden, lazily written, non-sensical "love triangle" with Rahim was none of those things!
Even the music before the kiss was ominous and foreboding!
VICTOR IS AT RAHIM'S DOOR > WHY?
1/ Victor & Benji always say "HEY", not "Hi" to each other, especially during "serious" discussions
2/ Benji is justifiably angry > Victor would be using a more contrite "can we please talk" tone of voice
3/ Rahim's door is the less predictable, surprise opening scene to freak our the largely disapproving fanbase
4/ BUT Victor isn't there to "choose" Rahim > He's there to tell him he still loves and is committed to Benji {Large majority of fans LOVE the Rahim character, but NOT if he's the unwelcome interloper who breaks up Venji. Both Victor and Rahim's popularity has taken a hit with this overly sudden, non-sensical "love triangle" storyline, which needs to be repaired asap so that Rahim can have his own independent romantic storyline with the required love, support, and enthusiasm of the global fanbase)
5/ Victor and Rahim work better as good friends > And having Victor suddenly fall in love with the FIRST new gay dude he meets is lame, cliched, and lazy script-writing from a talented team capable of far better storyline development!
BETTER QUESTION IS WHY WOULD BENJI STILL "CHOOSE" TO DATE TRUST-BREAKER, SERIAL KISSER VICTOR? {Most of the tsunami of EXTERNAL obstacles thrown at Venji's relationship by the writers have mostly been from Victor's side in dealing with his "coming out" drama! What happened to the sweet, thoughtful and "romantic" Victor of season 1 who Benji understandably fell for, minus all of his season 2 self-centered, sad-sack "coming out" drama?)
VICTOR ENDS UP WITH BENJI BY THE END OF SEASON 3 > WHY?
1/ Disney/Hulu + Producers bottom-line biz objectives are Ratings / Renewals / Spin-offs / PROFITS > achieved by giving viewers what they want and expect to see > And recent polls confirm 75% of fans want endgame Venji! (ALWAYS REMEMBER FOLKS THAT HOLLYWOOD IS A BOTTOM-LINE $$$ BUSINESS!)
2/ Viewers have invested 2 full seasons watching the carefully written and developed Venji relationship. Producers spent months casting both characters for their superb chemistry > Season 2 billboards featured Venji together prominently. They aren't going to toss this relationship away so easily from both a creative and BUSINESS $$ perspective!
3/ IF Victor's heart can so easily be swayed by veritable stranger newbie Rahim vs his first love / first sex Benji after 2 full seasons of relationship growth > WHY would viewers continue to invest their time following his his next "big romance"?
4/ It makes zero sense that Victor would close his eyes and be able to clearly see Rahim as the partner he's beaten the odds with in future since they've only hung out together as friends a few times vs 2 full seasons of romantic "firsts" with Benji
5/ Fans understand there needs to be "drama" in any teen series, but they also want and expect Venji's relationship to be given a fair-minded chance to be successful vs the overly contrived avalanche of "drama" thrown at it during season 2...
IT WILL TAKE SEVERAL S3 EPISODES FOR VENJI TO REPAIR THEIR RELATIONSHIP > JUST IN TIME FOR A MUCH HAPPIER JUNIOR PROM FINALE > SINCE EACH SEASON COVERS ROUGHLY 6 MONTHS IN VICTOR'S LIFE > Victor will need to regain Benji's trust after blabbing his AA secret to Rahim, then inviting him to the wedding, asking him to slow dance, failing to shut down his kiss, and admitting to Felix that he "felt something". The predictable storyline to achieve this happier expected outcome for most fans will be Benji's alcohol relapse battle which Victor will be there to help him through > a welcome change to see Victor providing love and support, rather than receiving it in spades from Benji and others in his "coming out" journey during the first two seasons! (CUE THE PREDICTABLE EPISODE 10 CROWD-PLEASING "KING & KING" VENJI PROM DANCE SCENE!) NEWSFLASH: Both Michael & George have had standard story-arc convos with Producers about where Venji's relationship is heading during season 3 and beyond > BUT > no interviewer ever asks them this question vs just asking about "who's door is Victor at?" > which doesn't actually mean this will be the person who Victor ultimately "chooses" > ENDGAME: VENJI > DUH!
I kinda like the show for what it is but Michael is so bad at acting
I wouldn't say he's bad. He was really good in season 1, IMO. But I will say season 2 seemed to be beyond his acting abilities
People, it is time to just admit what has always been true. This is a bad show. It is poorly written and plagued with bad acting. People watch bc the characters are hot and it has a sugary storyline.
Agree entirely.
What’s also worth mentioning in support of the door being Rahim’s, is that his story arc to date has been too brief to cut short.
It would be unnatural to introduce Rahim within three episodes, rapidly build up a “love triangle” and then entirely discard that idea and have Victor go straight back to Benji in episode 1 of season 3.
They’ll need content for season 3, and it can’t just be more Benji and Victor without a major complication.
I’m sort of disappointed that they’ve already skipped ahead on Benji’s and Rahim’s character development in several instances, making it hard to go back and fill that out in season 3.
For example, Benji apparently doesn’t do anything that isn’t about Victor and Rahim goes from having parents that are strictly conservative to being a-ok with his sexuality abruptly. I think the writers are doing the show a disservice by not expanding these areas. It’s now also too late to go back and focus more on Victor and Benji’s awkward first times — the one second lube scene was hardly sufficient (or accurate to the discussions/experimentation/teaching that could have taken place between Benji and Victor).
Had these been expanded to land us in a different place in season 3, we wouldn’t be stuck with a third season still centred around relationship troubles.
Overall, I think we could see:
Victor say “Hi” to Rahim, only to have a debrief about Victor/Benji and have Rahim say that Victor isn’t ready for a relationship — leaving Victor with no love interest for a few episodes and a time to “be single and work on himself” (a sort of narrative reset). Alternatively, we could, as you said, see a few episodes with Rahim as a love interest before returning to Benji by the end of the season.
That’d leave the writers in a position to make a fourth season about Benji and Victor’s long distance relationship and going to college or whatnot (if the series survives that long).
His character is very 2-Dimensional and whether that's because of his acting or because of the writing is debatable. Could be both lol.
