Date rape. What do you think?

[galaxus]

It the subject of my new blog. Here is a little excerpt of it. You can read the rest here: Durtydee's Blog

"In my Women's Studies class, we watched a video about the cultural backlash against the date rape epidemic that was discovered in the 90’s. At first the media couldn’t stop talking about it. Then out of nowhere, the media started discrediting what they just said. A mass of conservatives called it a myth, a lie, and an exaggeration. Their arguments and constant attacks against the scientific studies proving epidemic of date the even tricked many young men and women. It was so bad, that even a young ivy league educated woman named Katie Roiphe wrote a book on how she thinks date rape is a lie. Her book was basically a regurgitation of what other conservative pundits said before her...."


I'm asking you ladies your opinions on date rape. What is it? Is it really rape? Is it really a problem? So a guy watches a girl gets drunk and tries to get an easy lay. Is that so wrong??? *I'm trying to be neutral*

 

[Pendlum]

Normally I avoid doing this because I'm not a woman, but I have to say that it is rape, and rape is always wrong. People like to say when the liquor goes in the truth comes out, but the reality is that it fucks with your ability to make proper judgments. That isn't truth, that is distortion.

 

[B_Nick8]

As a man who suffered date rape I can tell you that yes, it is a very real problem. When I was 19 years old, I made the mistake of allowing a good-looking, older acquaintance of mine to buy me a couple of drinks when he ran into me at a bar and then accepted his offer to drive me home. I knew there was a problem when he bypassed my house but he insisted he just wanted to go for a drive. We ended up at a park miles outside of the city where he suddenly wanted to go for a walk. Afraid to anger him, I agreed.

He was big, very strong and, ultimately extremely forceful and he made it quite clear that I wasn't going to get home, and certainly not safely, until we had sex. This, knowing my boyfriend of three years was waiting for me at home. I totally disassociated; it was as though I wasn't even there. It was incredibly humiliating.

I never told anyone. I felt as though it was my fault. I shouldn't have had the drinks. I shouldn't have accepted the ride. Maybe I should have tried to fight him. The guilt was overwhelming. It took me years to even realize that it was rape.

I can not even begin to understand why someone would seek to minimize much less rationalize the concept of date rape; it's a serious and on-going problem.

 

[invisibleman]

As a man who suffered date rape I can tell you that yes, it is a very real problem. When I was 19 years old, I made the mistake of allowing a good-looking, older acquaintance of mine to buy me a couple of drinks when he ran into me at a bar and then accepted his offer to drive me home. I knew there was a problem when he bypassed my house but he insisted he just wanted to go for a drive. We ended up at a park miles outside of the city where he suddenly wanted to go for a walk. Afraid to anger him, I agreed.

He was big, very strong and, ultimately extremely forceful and he made it quite clear that I wasn't going to get home, and certainly not safely, until we had sex. This, knowing my boyfriend of three years was waiting for me at home. I totally disassociated; it was as though I wasn't even there. It was incredibly humiliating.

I never told anyone. I felt as though it was my fault. I shouldn't have had the drinks. I shouldn't have accepted the ride. Maybe I should have tried to fight him. The guilt was overwhelming. It took me years to even realize that it was rape.

I can not even begin to understand why someone would seek to minimize much less rationalize the concept of date rape; it's a serious and on-going problem.

I bet that affected you a lot. I know that I would be affected. Did you ever run into him again at the bar? I would be pissed off. Totally.

 

[NotSoDumb_Blonde]

Normally I avoid doing this because I'm not a woman, but I have to say that it is rape, and rape is always wrong. People like to say when the liquor goes in the truth comes out, but the reality is that it fucks with your ability to make proper judgments. That isn't truth, that is distortion.

I have to agree. If the reason to give a girl too much to drink is to get laid, then, yeah, it's not cool.

 

[B_Nick8]

I bet that affected you a lot. I know that I would be affected. Did you ever run into him again at the bar? I would be pissed off. Totally.

I saw him once, across a bar, a few months later, and I didn't know if I was going to kill him or throw up but I was with my boyfriend and I just found an excuse to leave. He was a Harvard grad student and luckily he left town soon after.

 

[Snakebyte]

Taking sexual advantage of a person who's not mentally fit to 100% actually is rape in my opinion.

 

[Incocknito]

If you drug someone and kill them...is it really murder?

If you drug someone and steal from them...is it really robbery?

If you drug someone and then kidnap them...is it really kidnapping?

 

[helgaleena]

Agreed, Incocknito. Rape is rape, and force is force.

 

[galaxus]

If you drug someone and kill them...is it really murder?

If you drug someone and steal from them...is it really robbery?

If you drug someone and then kidnap them...is it really kidnapping?

What if they get drunk themselves? What if there is no force at all?

Yet young people do it all the time. They think that's how you get laid. Guys have frat parties to get drunk and to get women drunk to have sex with them. They blatantly advertise it as a place to "get drunk and fuck". Is that a problem?

 

[Incocknito]

What if they get drunk themselves? What if there is no force at all?

Then its not necessarily date rape as it is commonly known. You are confusing women getting drunk with women having their drinks spiked, blacking out, being raped and then having no recollection of what happened.

Most women who get drunk don't black out and don't get raped and have at least some recollection.

Yet young people do it all the time. They think that's how you get laid. Guys have frat parties to get drunk and to get women drunk to have sex with them. They blatantly advertise it as a place to "get drunk and fuck". Is that a problem?

I wouldn't say they do it all the time. And if someone is drunk to the point where they don't know what's happening, can't walk, can't talk, etc then I believe in the eyes of the law, someone who had sex with them could be convicted of rape.

Just because a woman dresses "slutty" or is in a druken stupor doesn't mean she wants to or should be raped.

You can buy a girl drinks and have sex with her, it's not necessarily malicious.

There's also a difference between getting a girl "tipsy" drunk and "can't walk and throwing up" drunk. If someone is intentionally getting a girl drunk to the point where she is unable to speak or act properly then that to me shows a malicious intent and in that case it would be rape.

But getting a girl some drinks then going back to her place isn't rape, it's just social custom.

...

 

[invisibleman]

I saw him once, across a bar, a few months later, and I didn't know if I was going to kill him or throw up but I was with my boyfriend and I just found an excuse to leave. He was a Harvard grad student and luckily he left town soon after.

I feel for you, bud. I believe in Karma. That comes back on them later on.

Sometimes men are predatorial and sociopathic.

 

[galaxus]

Then its not necessarily date rape as it is commonly known. You are confusing women getting drunk with women having their drinks spiked, blacking out, being raped and then having no recollection of what happened.

Most women who get drunk don't black out and don't get raped and have at least some recollection.

No. A girl doesn't have to be drugged or need to black out to be date raped. Girls can go to a party to dance and have a good time. They can drink until they're tipsy or until they're throwing up. But when they do this, they could end up in a situation when they're pressured into having sex with a guy. They may be too scared to say no. They may not understand what's happening. But if they didn't plan on having sex or they didn't want to have sex but just couldn't say no, it's still rape.

But getting a girl some drinks then going back to her place isn't rape, it's just social custom.

It's not rape in that case. But getting drunk and going home with a guy still doesn't equal consent.

 

[dolfette]

so what you're asking here is...

is agreeing to go on a date with a guy an unbreakable, iron clad, no get out clause contract binding you to have sex with him no matter what?

i would say no.

rape within marriage isn't allowed, despite the fact that you actually have signed a contract, in front of witnesses, to ''with my body i thee worship...till death to us part.''

 

[galaxus]

So do you think Marital Rape doesn't exist?

 

[dolfette]

and the reasons for victim blame are obvious.

if date rape only happens to sluts and drunks, if it only really happens when a girl has lead a guy on past the mythical point of no return, if it's something entirely preventable which the girl has brought upon herself, then it will never happen to me! and i can get on with my life without the fear that every day i'm alive there's a chance i could be raped and there's fuck all i can do about it.

it lets them sleep at night and walk the streets without fear.

dream the peaceful dreams of happy ostriches!

 

[dolfette]

So do you think Marital Rape doesn't exist?

don't be stupid

 

[the_reverend]

i'm generally against it.

 

[galaxus]

i'm generally against it.

What do you mean by that?

 

[D_Kaye Throttlebottom]

I see the mention of drinking and date-rape drugs.

Acquaintances, Dates, even co-workers, etc. at an event can rape you and it's not violent, it's bullying and threatening. You may be attracted to that person and getting to know them and their impatience believes it obligates you to accomodate them with sex. They have colossilly huge egos that cannot fathom rejection and just convince themselves you are teasing or playing hard to get.

It's not a myth and those that are arguing that it isn't a problem have not had their boundaries violated before. I congratulate them for it - but fuck off telling me that because it does not happen to you it does not happen period.

I'm a little confused that the "90's" was the period of backlash against date-rape. I was an undergrad and it was constantly spoken about. Later in the military they called it sexual harassment and men did it anyway.

I'm sorry for what happened to you Nick, but I appreciate you sharing.

I try writing this post and get upset and started to write, what I usually say when I meet a man saying that date-rape is not possible and starts what-ifing. Normally, I do the same - what if he were drunk, "oh know that would never happen." No, if you're asking me to what-if, he has to do the same, what if he's drunk enough and some guy takes advantage and gives him head? If I have to what-if - you have to? The next morning when you sober, are you denying it happened? Yes. It happened. I'd kick his ass. You consented? I was drunk. You agreed to drink with him. You get the idea.

Acquaintance and date-rape happens in closed doors in the dark. It's bullying, predatory, the need to dominate, control, overpower, threaten, incapicitate to will an outcome with someone. The "no-brainer" sexual assault by a complete stranger is so many assign, but date-rape is criminal and it is a problem.

I really feel for you Nick and I'd like to say that years later, that feeling that you'll throw-up or wanting to kill goes away. It takes time to process that your boundaries are violated and blame yourself...society blames us on the onset. You blame yourself that had you done A,B,C,D different, it would have never happened.

I have a hard time restraining myself from people that argue from a position that it never happens, when they've never been terrified or had their boundaries violated.

-Z.