Double Standards?

lpsgnoob

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@Emjay

I think now it depends on your picking skills. I know sometimes when you have crush one someone you will overlook the flaws. But dates are meant for checking up partner and getting to know who your date really is so you just need to take it easy and listen to your head not your heart. :smile:

But yea it will be hard avoiding all this extra drama :frown1:.. but ah well we all have to go through the dirt to get that diamond remember?? :tongue:
 

EmJay

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hahahaha...that Diamond is going to shine really well..with all of that work being done :)..
 

petite

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Plus personally, relationships where you have sex right away never last that long or are that rewarding/meaningful anyway.
I've had the exact opposite experience. The guys I dated where I didn't sleep with them before the 3rd date and I followed all the "rules" were the guys I was never really into very much, and our time together wasn't memorable. The guys that I just happened to meet and connect with right away and had great chemistry and I slept with almost right off the bat, those have been my long term relationships, the whirlwind romances, the most memorable experiences of my life.

I think Helgaleena is right. If I had had more chemistry with those guys I was following the rules with, I would have stopped following the rules. First off, the only reason to follow any rules is because you're unsure of how a man feels about you. Well, when I've met someone where there's been an intense connection, I've believed that connection was strong enough that following rules wasn't necessary, like with TheBF, because he was showing me how interested in me he was and I trusted him and believed in him. Secondly, it is really easy to resist having sex with someone that you aren't powerfully attracted to. Not having sex with you and waiting might really mean that we don't have much chemistry at all, and if I meet someone else with whom I have more chemistry in the future, then I'll drop you for him in a moment. Wait, I think I've done that... Not with a long term serious partner, but I've been dating someone non-exclusively while following the dating "rules" and dropped him for someone I actually had good chemistry with.
I think there is a double standard, and I agree that it isn't fair. For me, as someone else suggested, I guess the thought is if she would sleep with me so easily, she'll sleep with someone else easily as well and it seems that chances are significantly higher that she'd sleep with someone else while going out with me. As I said, I don't think it's fair, but I think that's just how some people think.
You're the second person I've heard mention fidelity as a motivation. My entire life I thought it was about past partners and a man's comparable bedroom skills and how intimidated he might feel about that, but I see now that some men are concerned about fidelity. See my comment above about that!
Sex is just another form of communication for me. It really makes no difference if she sleeps with me on the first date or on the third. My respect for her (or anyone for that matter) has absolutely nothing to do with sex, but more about the individual's value system. We're not supposed to judge people, but we all do.
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I already knew that you were an enlightened man.
No problem for me. If that was all she wanted, so be it. But from my own experience, it actually got that sometimes awkward hurdle out of that way; in essence, no game playing.
I agree, I hate game playing. One of the things I LOVED about TheBF was that he never played any games. He acted interested in me, I was interested in him, and that hasn't changed since the moment we met. It's the way it should be. No bullshit.
I am in a long term relationship at the moment and we had sex the first night we met, and the next night, and now years later, we are still doin' the do. The thing is to select partners who are of the same mindset, with similar standards about sex, love, intimacy, friendship, etc., so there's no confusion.
That's the way mine have happened so many times!
The bolded part is faulty reasoning. Having sex with someone right away means you are extra sexy, usually. Why blame your sexiness on the susceptible female?

If I don't have sex with you and make you wait for weeks and months, I feel like I am just a player trying to get you to pay for fancy meals etc. and you are not actually that attractive. In all honesty I should enlighten you about it but mister Sexier Than Thou has not yet arrived.

addendum: How the hell do I know if we are actually a compatible couple before we have sex? I don't! It's got to be addressed sometime, IMO sooner rather than later.
You are so right.
interestingly enough 3/4 of my long term relationships have been with a girl i had sex with on a first date.....i think it was because our connection was so strong we couldnt resist....that attaction carried over into life together
So have mine! Except I think I have a 100% rate there.
There is definitely a double standard.

I would personally never discount a girl/lady who had sex on the first date. I feel like single women should be allowed to express their sexuality as much as they want and with who they want without having to suffer through the accusations of being "whorish" or "slutty".
That's the right attitude to have! :smile:
 

helgaleena

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I always pressure the males I am dating to have sex. Otherwise it would be a friendship, right? And if they are unwilling, big red flag about going any further.

The ones who were willing and did not meet my compatibility standards got dropped. But my standards have risen with the years as I learned ever more about how wonderful sex can be. Also as I have matured I resemble the 'feminine ideal' portrayed in the media ever less. These two factors weed out the pool considerably to tolerable levels.

Who has the double standard, me or the 'shy' ones concealing something?
 

EmJay

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So how do you know you are about to have sex with 'the right guy' instead of some lying douchebag..

I would like to know we match sexually, without getting my emotions ahead of myself. Dating for a long time before sex can screw with your mind if you are not careful..Dating for a short time and having sex can screw with your mind too..if it doesnt end well..
 

borntobeking

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Speaking for myself only, I have no problem with a woman that is comfortable having sex on the first date. It would not preclude any interest in a long-term relationship or anything else. It's just sex. People in general (male and female) tend to have too many hang-ups about it. I do not view a woman negatively in this regard at all.

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
 

helgaleena

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So how do you know you are about to have sex with 'the right guy' instead of some lying douchebag..

I would like to know we match sexually, without getting my emotions ahead of myself. Dating for a long time before sex can screw with your mind if you are not careful..Dating for a short time and having sex can screw with your mind too..if it doesnt end well..

Having sex brings quite a lot into the open, especially lying douchebag-ism, IME :tongue: I do not become emotionally attached to somebody who can't turn me on, and I am not turned on by being treated like an appliance. It also helps to be naked with a person. Harder to tell lies naked, believe me.
 

B_subgirrl

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I always pressure the males I am dating to have sex. Otherwise it would be a friendship, right? And if they are unwilling, big red flag about going any further.

The ones who were willing and did not meet my compatibility standards got dropped. But my standards have risen with the years as I learned ever more about how wonderful sex can be. Also as I have matured I resemble the 'feminine ideal' portrayed in the media ever less. These two factors weed out the pool considerably to tolerable levels.

Who has the double standard, me or the 'shy' ones concealing something?

I was actually about to say something along these lines (not quite the same, but similar). I also like to know that we're sexually compatible before I put the effort in to take it further.

Plus, having sex with a guy early weeds out the assholes pretty damn quickly. If he doesn't treat you kindly and with respect during sex, dump him. If he doesn't treat you kindly and with respect the next morning, dump him. Why put in all the effort over days, weeks or months if he's going to turn out to be an asshole? Better to find out quickly, I think. And it means I get sex :biggrin1:.


So how do you know you are about to have sex with 'the right guy' instead of some lying douchebag..

This only matters if you see sex as something sacred, something to be 'given away', like we 'give away' our virginity. To me, it doesn't really matter if the guy I have sex with is a good guy or a lying douchebag (and he certainly doesn't have to be the 'right' guy). What does matter to me is who I invest time, effort and emotions in. It doesn't cost me much in time, effort or emotions to fuck someone. But it will cost me a whole heap of the above if I fuck around getting to know him before I have sex with him.
 

EmJay

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I was actually about to say something along these lines (not quite the same, but similar). I also like to know that we're sexually compatible before I put the effort in to take it further.

Plus, having sex with a guy early weeds out the assholes pretty damn quickly. If he doesn't treat you kindly and with respect during sex, dump him. If he doesn't treat you kindly and with respect the next morning, dump him. Why put in all the effort over days, weeks or months if he's going to turn out to be an asshole? Better to find out quickly, I think. And it means I get sex :biggrin1:.




This only matters if you see sex as something sacred, something to be 'given away', like we 'give away' our virginity. To me, it doesn't really matter if the guy I have sex with is a good guy or a lying douchebag (and he certainly doesn't have to be the 'right' guy). What does matter to me is who I invest time, effort and emotions in. It doesn't cost me much in time, effort or emotions to fuck someone. But it will cost me a whole heap of the above if I fuck around getting to know him before I have sex with him.

Yes there is absolutely truth there.. I am just too sensitive i guess..I need to toughen up more.. I have wasted lots of time..doing absolutely nothing out of fear of getting hurt or that he would be 'only after my ass' (which looks nice by the way :wink:). I want to get to know someone AND have sex and enjoy that part of 'getting to know each other' as well..without the hangups.

It does not appeal to me at all..to play some virtuous game untill the 4th date or after..only to get my hopes up or have it end in a few night stands.. But then again..if they end in just a few or whatever..it was never meant to be in the first place..and better know this early instead of wasting a lot of time (if that is not what i would like).

Its just that doing it too early raises a greater chance of things not working out it seems..although I know many who have had sex early and are still together to this day..so its a bit confusing...

I'm not saying by the way that I want to have sex with every guy I meet..hahaha LOL Hell no...But sometimes you find yourself attracted on more levels than one..and when I feel those boxes are ticked..my sexuality can get the best of me :smile:.. I'm literally hot for him..

And I'm not falling in love with every guy I have sex with either. But it does feel like some sort of rejection.. :redface:.. I don't like that feeling. But those are my own insecurities..I know.

I know that in the end it all comes down to one thing: What do I want to do.... what do I feel..What do I need..right now.

After all ..thats all I can do..and should focus on as a woman.

@helgaleena..you made me laugh so much when you said you pressured guys to have sex early LOL. There is so much truth in what you all say..

The art of letting go of expectations I guess..
 

Icarium

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I don't think less or more of a woman who has sex on the first date to me you've both reached a level, time and place together, the question is why are you both at this place, need, desire, opportunity? Once sex is over this question is usually answered People are strange creatures and our motives vary greatly, yes you can weed out the opportunist, the bragger the desperate, but there are times when its just a perfect way to end a very pleasant evening (unfortunately its also the way to ruin it to lol)

Does it matter if your first date is a blind date (having never met them before) or you know them or know of them but have never been out with them, how much of a difference does this make?
 

petite

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I'm like Emjay. I am more sensitive than subgirrl, too. I really don't want to have sex with someone I don't like, and the idea of discovering the day after I've had sex with him that I don't like him really bothers me. Discovering the next day that I hate his guts is even worse. I'm with Emjay. If I were single, I would want to know how to weed out the jerks before I had sex with them, even though having sex with them would weed out the jerks. The absolute worst is running into a guy that you slept with that you hate. Argh! I would want to avoid that experience as much as possible.

I've never known a man who continued the whole double standard thing who was older than 24. I know some of my male roommates who were 18-21 did it (And they pissed me off about it and there were one or two heated conversations about it. I felt like the guardian of all the unsuspecting females who entered our house), but I believe they grew out of it years later.

And I actually remembered someone else who I think broke up with me because of the double standard thing (we're talking about ancient history here, so some of these memories take a while to surface because I don't exactly dwell on which guys in my past have done this or that, it's threads like these that make me go gravedigging for memories), but unlike the guy who pissed me off, he didn't actually tell me that was the reason and he wasn't mean to me or blame me or shame me, so he didn't piss me off. He just never asked me out again after one last sort of awkward date, and I moved on after him and started dating someone else. He was 23 at the time. Years later, we ran into each other at one of my old hangouts, and we caught up with each other and he told me he had gotten married and divorced and he began saying things like, "Where have you been? I've been looking for you..." in a seriously wistful way, telling me he really missed me. He seemed like he wanted to pick up where we left off before, but I wasn't single and I wouldn't have dated him again anyway because of what happened the first time. If he had rejected me at 23 for having slept with him too early, he obviously no longer thought that mattered years later when he wanted to date me again.

So maybe you can avoid men who think like that by avoiding the young ones? None of the men I dated who were around the age of 30 thought like that. Or have your experiences been different than mine and you've found that slightly older men can be ignorant, too?

For some reason, men who are jocks seem to be more likely to have double standards, from my personal experience. The men I've dated who read the most books, they were the least likely to impose double standards or be chauvinistic.
 
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EmJay

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So maybe you can avoid men who think like that by avoiding the young ones? None of the men I dated who were around the age of 30 thought like that. Or have your experiences been different than mine and you've found that slightly older men can be ignorant, too?

Yes.. say 30-35 year old guys :confused:

I honestly expect a young guy (say 21-27) to be all about sex..for just one time or more whatever. I expect nothing more really..

But 30-somethings is a different story..

But maybe the type of men who are drawn to me are always just in it for sex and never see me for anything more..Its weird to think about that. But maybe that's the answer..:redface:
 

petite

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Yes.. say 30-35 year old guys :confused:

I honestly expect a young guy (say 21-27) to be all about sex..for just one time or more whatever. I expect nothing more really..

But 30-somethings is a different story..

But maybe the type of men who are drawn to me are always just in it for sex and never see me for anything more..Its weird to think about that. But maybe that's the answer..:redface:

We're also in completely different countries, too, so what applies here may not apply there. We have different cultures.

I have to be honest. I would say that 75% of the dating bullshit I experienced when I was young and single and at my most hot, when I was around the age of 21, I stopped having after I decided I wouldn't date men my age any more. The guys who were also 21 just weren't worth the trouble because they made me miserable. When I only dated men who were around 28-32, dating became a lot more fun and a lot less of a hassle. I've preferred men in that age bracket ever since then. (Not that all those guys were actually mature, either, but there were fewer problems.)
 
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men in a word are stupid. for the most part they want conquest..but when a woman is capable of getting sex they get jealous..sad . Woman of lpsg..ya want to fuck a big cock? go for it! without fear of what men think..you only go around ONCE..live your life to the fullest! it's what we all should do!
 

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men in a word are stupid. for the most part they want conquest..but when a woman is capable of getting sex they get jealous..sad . Woman of lpsg..ya want to fuck a big cock? go for it! without fear of what men think..you only go around ONCE..live your life to the fullest! it's what we all should do!

hear hear :biggrin1:...

I'm so tired of the bullshit..
 

petite

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hear hear :biggrin1:...

I'm so tired of the bullshit..

Oh, I can see your age now! I couldn't place you, couldn't tell which generation you were in. Are you like me? Mistaken for a young woman a lot? Last year I was at a wedding reception where the bride was in her early twenties and at the reception I was at a table with her friends. They assumed I was as young as them! It was the best compliment ever. A man compliments your looks, and he might be just flattering you. A woman genuinely mistakes you for being her age? That's a real compliment.

I don't blame you about the dating BS. I remember older guys weren't perfect either, and some of them played dumb games, too. There was this one time I went out with a guy and it was the most tense date of my life. I wasn't interested in a second date. Every single time I ran into him, he pouted at me and acted hurt and got sarcastic. I couldn't believe a man as old as him could act so immature. Another time, one guy attempted to "trick" me into going out on a date with him. Looking back, I think he did it because he didn't think I would say yes if he asked me straight out, but how could he think he had any chance with me at all if he didn't believe I would even say yes to a date with him? :rolleyes:

Dating can really suck. I don't know what to tell you. I never had a strategy or anything. I just bumbled my way around and sometimes I met a guy who was really great, and the rest of the time it was... Well, it was dating, which was sometimes fun, sometimes frustrating, and sometimes really awkward and uncomfortable.
 
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EmJay

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Oh, I can see your age now! I couldn't place you, couldn't tell which generation you were in. Are you like me? Mistaken for a young woman a lot? .

hahaha..you are terrible.. I AM A YOUNG WOMAN!!! :biggrin1:..haha..but i do get often that i look younger in real life..runs in my family :smile:

But at my age dating is not much fun. I don't feel like weeding out anymore.. Let them weed out themselves. It makes you either insecure or distrustful or both... the whole weeding thing.....very tiring.

I just want to enjoy all aspects of my life..without the BS..

And actually I can..I make my own money, own my own house, have a nice job and if all goes well will be starting a business next year..
Life is good..I just need more sex from great men :biggrin1:..I dont want douchebags to touch my body..

But since I'm starting to get a better feel for reality now..i might just have to accept that there is really no way to avoid that..if I want to stay true to myself and my lifes desires..

My grandma..she is almost 85 bless her heart..I absolutely love her.. She told me a year ago in a conversation we were having about love.. 'MJ ...three is a magic number'--and then started to laugh..

So i frowned my eyebrows and asked my aunt what she meant..My aunt said-- Don't start focussing your attention on one guy if you can have 3 guys attend to your needs'--

Cheeky Grandma I have :biggrin1:..but I have always known that she has been a very desirable woman back in her day
 

petite

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hahaha..you are terrible.. I AM A YOUNG WOMAN!!! :biggrin1:..haha..but i do get often that i look younger in real life..runs in my family :smile:

But at my age dating is not much fun. I don't feel like weeding out anymore.. Let them weed out themselves. It makes you either insecure or distrustful or both... the whole weeding thing.....very tiring.

I just want to enjoy all aspects of my life..without the BS..

And actually I can..I make my own money, own my own house, have a nice job and if all goes well will be starting a business next year..
Life is good..I just need more sex from great men :biggrin1:..I dont want douchebags to touch my body..

But since I'm starting to get a better feel for reality now..i might just have to accept that there is really no way to avoid that..if I want to stay true to myself and my lifes desires..

My grandma..she is almost 85 bless her heart..I absolutely love her.. She told me a year ago in a conversation we were having about love.. 'MJ ...three is a magic number'--and then started to laugh..

So i frowned my eyebrows and asked my aunt what she meant..My aunt said-- Don't start focussing your attention on one guy if you can have 3 guys attend to your needs'--

Cheeky Grandma I have :biggrin1:..but I have always known that she has been a very desirable woman back in her day

LOL! That's right! I need to think like you! Sorry, I'm your age, and I feel ancient. I don't feel like a young woman, even though I'm told I look young. I usually thing of "young" as someone who is in her twenties. Some days I feel like I've already lived a few lifetimes lately. I need to feel young again!

I love your grandmother! :biggrin1:

I don't know how to avoid douchebags from touching you. I wish there was a secret test. A series of questions you could ask surreptitiously that would discover if a man's actual motives differ from how he's acting and the things he says, so that only guys who deserve to get laid actually get laid, the guys who are honest and sincere. But there isn't, as far as I know.
 

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Yes there is absolutely truth there.. I am just too sensitive i guess..I need to toughen up more..

I'm like Emjay. I am more sensitive than subgirrl, too.

I think we're all sensitive in our own way. The idea of spending time getting to know someone, and possibly losing your heart to them, THEN discovering that they're an asshole, absolutely horrifies me. Seriously, it's not something I want to be doing.

That's not the only reason I'm happy to have sex early on, nor is it the main reason, but it certainly influences my decision. And of course, having sex with someone won't show up all their faults, but it does highlight the occasional guy I would never go near again.


Its just that doing it too early raises a greater chance of things not working out it seems..although I know many who have had sex early and are still together to this day..so its a bit confusing...

I've said this before, but if he were to judge me for having sex with him straight away, or if he lost interest because he didn't have to chase me, he wouldn't be the right guy for me anyway.


I know that in the end it all comes down to one thing: What do I want to do.... what do I feel..What do I need..right now.

THAT is what's important. If you think having sex on the first date is okay, you should do it. But if you DON'T think that's okay, then you shouldn't be doing it. As long as you don't hurt anyone in the process, you should do what feels right to you. Not what's right for me, or what's right for someone else - what's right for YOU.


I really don't want to have sex with someone I don't like, and the idea of discovering the day after I've had sex with him that I don't like him really bothers me. Discovering the next day that I hate his guts is even worse. I'm with Emjay. If I were single, I would want to know how to weed out the jerks before I had sex with them, even though having sex with them would weed out the jerks.

I'm so the opposite!!! The less time I spend with them before I find out they're an asshole, the better! And that applies doubly, or triply if emotions are likely to become involved.

I think the difference, yet again, comes down to how we each view sex. To me, sex is just sex. There are no emotions inherently involved with sex (for me). Having sex with him doesn't make me feel I've exposed my soul to him, or made myself vulnerable in any way. However, the better he knows me, the more I DO feel exposed and vulnerable. So I'm thinking that all three of us (me, you, Emjay) seem to have the same basic thing happening (we don't want to expose ourselves and get hurt), but we feel differently about how that is most likely to happen.


The absolute worst is running into a guy that you slept with that you hate. Argh! I would want to avoid that experience as much as possible.

I'm not a fan of it either, but I have very few of those in my past, if any. I have a few I don't like, but I'm not sure I have any I hate.


So maybe you can avoid men who think like that by avoiding the young ones? None of the men I dated who were around the age of 30 thought like that. Or have your experiences been different than mine and you've found that slightly older men can be ignorant, too?

For some reason, men who are jocks seem to be more likely to have double standards, from my personal experience. The men I've dated who read the most books, they were the least likely to impose double standards or be chauvinistic.

It seems to me that it is much more common in younger males. Although I would have put the age limit for this kind of behaviour even lower, maybe at around 20.

I also feel that this kind of behaviour seems less likely to occur in those who are more well read, more educated, or more intelligent (I really tried to think of a PC way to write that, but couldn't :redface:). I think it occurs less in these instances because those sorts of people are the most likely to be able to think for themselves, and are less likely to just rely on what society has told them to think (this could explain the age effect as well). This DOES not mean that I think less educated people are less intelligent, or that I think less well read, less educated, or less intelligent people can't or don't think for themselves.


I don't think less or more of a woman who has sex on the first date to me you've both reached a level, time and place together, the question is why are you both at this place, need, desire, opportunity? Once sex is over this question is usually answered People are strange creatures and our motives vary greatly, yes you can weed out the opportunist, the bragger the desperate, but there are times when its just a perfect way to end a very pleasant evening (unfortunately its also the way to ruin it to lol)

Does it matter if your first date is a blind date (having never met them before) or you know them or know of them but have never been out with them, how much of a difference does this make?

From your posts so far, you seem like a really lovely guy :smile:.