open relationship

B_subgirrl

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I apologize for my ignorance on this matter, but what is the difference between swinging and being poly? I thought they were just 2 different ways to describe the same thing?

Definitions vary a bit between different communities. My definitions are pretty similar to both Fade's and VT's:

Swinging - Like VT's definition, for me the word conjures visions of swingers clubs etc. Both partners go together, leave together, and are likely to play together.

Open relationships - rules vary from one couple to another, but basically means 'we can have sex with others'. The sex itself may happen as a couple or alone. Could even apply to only one partner of a relationship.

Poly - Much more relationship based and tend to involve deeper feelings between the original couple and any additional partners (although may not always involve sex). Some are just a committed relationship that includes more than two people. Some have slightly different dynamics (forexample, some people with a D/s dynamic). Some people (as Fade alluded to) may use the terms 'primary', 'secondary' etc to refer to their partners, with the primary partner often being the first to be a part of that particular relationship. For example, if Sir was to have a second slave, I would be the 'primary', whilst she would be the 'secondary'. Oh, and while poly seems to be more common amongst the BDSM community, it's by no means limited to that community. I have no doubt Fade could explain this one much better than I can.
 

LisaMarie

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Definitions vary a bit between different communities. My definitions are pretty similar to both Fade's and VT's:

Swinging - Like VT's definition, for me the word conjures visions of swingers clubs etc. Both partners go together, leave together, and are likely to play together.

Open relationships - rules vary from one couple to another, but basically means 'we can have sex with others'. The sex itself may happen as a couple or alone. Could even apply to only one partner of a relationship.

Poly - Much more relationship based and tend to involve deeper feelings between the original couple and any additional partners (although may not always involve sex). Some are just a committed relationship that includes more than two people. Some have slightly different dynamics (forexample, some people with a D/s dynamic). Some people (as Fade alluded to) may use the terms 'primary', 'secondary' etc to refer to their partners, with the primary partner often being the first to be a part of that particular relationship. For example, if Sir was to have a second slave, I would be the 'primary', whilst she would be the 'secondary'. Oh, and while poly seems to be more common amongst the BDSM community, it's by no means limited to that community. I have no doubt Fade could explain this one much better than I can.

Thank you ladies. I appreciate you breaking it down for me. Ok, so I have one last question. How were you able to make your open relationships emotionally healthy for you? Meaning how were you able to overcome the hurt? The jealousy? The resentment? I ask because those are the emotions I personally would be struggling with. Was it a relatively comfortable transition for you to make the first time you agreed to (or suggested) trying it? Or was it difficult for you? Maybe you're just not wired the same way as me? A lot less insecure? I sure envy that level of freedom and confidence.

Dang maybe this should have been a new thread? Lol!! Sorry! Just so curious!!! Ok... Shutting up now!
 
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Thank you ladies. I appreciate you breaking it down for me. Ok, so I have one last question. How were you able to make your open relationships emotionally healthy for you? Meaning how were you able to overcome the hurt? The jealousy? The resentment? I ask because those are the emotions I personally would be struggling with. Was it a relatively comfortable transition for you to make the first time you agreed to (or suggested) trying it? Or was it difficult for you? Maybe you're just not wired the same way as me? A lot less insecure? I sure envy that level of freedom and confidence.

No problem. I have written a blog about bdsm/relationships/other shit for almost a year and a half now, as well as have moved through/participated in my local kinky community since I was 18 + have known a fair variety of people who have "non-traditional" relationships.

How was I able to have polyamorous relationships that were emotionally healthy? Well, quite frankly, even from the first serious relationship I had when I was 18 and since then, I've been a bit... odd. I do get jealous, I do have insecurities, but I don't react to things like other people might. I realize that I won't met all of a partner's needs/desires most likely. I manage to be secure enough in my desirability/my partner's affection, that I can have no problem with them fucking someone else.

To put it another way, a m/f couple that I know had been strictly monogamous for years. The female had expressed interest in women as well for quite some time. Finally it came to a head one evening during a party that all of us were at. Myself and another pointed out to her boyfriend that he shouldn't feel bad that he wasn't woman enough for her. Given how many kinks I have/how much of a weirdo I am in some ways, I know it's incredibly unlikely that any single person is going to meet all my needs. I don't resent a partner for wanting things that I am unable to provide.

On the other hand, since I do have some insecurities/jealousy, my boundaries vary. If say, I started dating someone and was interested but we weren't committed to each other in any way shape or form, and I found out they had started seeing someone on the side, it would bother me (this is different than when I'm casually dating someone and know that we're both going on dates with other people).

For the flip side of that, I was dating two people at one point. I was at the local sex positive center/dungeon on a date with one of them, when I encountered someone else. That new person has now been my play partner for over a year. I've known since pretty much day one that he has a wife. I'm perfectly secure in my position with him, given that he sought me out and continues to seek my company. I'm able to say "Have fun, have a good date, have good sex" to him and to mean it. I can talk with his wife about sex too. Hell, she sometimes presents as male, so I've been getting tips on how to properly bind my breasts + pass as male (no I'm not transgender, I'm gender-fluid).

My first serious relationship, we were monogamous for quite some time. He wasn't meeting all of my needs, however. He was 100% non-kinky. After a time I started to chafe under the lack of certain things. We talked, argued, and negotiated for a long time. Eventually we came to a compromise, I was allowed to go to the local dungeon and receive pain, but I couldn't fuck anybody else. Just like anyone else I am struck sometimes by insecurity and jealousy, but I'm able to be happy for partner(s) too when they have happiness with someone else.

A word for this, is compersion. Pulling a definition/explanation from wikipedia, compersion is a state of empathetic happiness and joy experienced when an individual's current or former romantic partner experiences happiness and joy through an outside source, including, but not limited to, another romantic interest. This can be experienced as any form of erotic or emotional empathy, depending on the person experiencing the emotion.

Anyway, this is a bit of a ridiculously long post. Hopefully it was at least a little helpful. :biggrin1:
 
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LisaMarie

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Anyway, this is a bit of a ridiculously long post. Hopefully it was at least a little helpful. :biggrin1:



Very helpful. Thank you so much. I was under the impression that being in an open relationship was a selfish thing. Like yeah, I want you and want whoever else I want too. But the way you explain it, it's actually the opposite of selfish. There is a great deal of sacrifice on both sides - done with the hopes of ensuring your partners happiness.

Very illuminating. Thank you again Fade! :wink:
 
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Very helpful. Thank you so much. I was under the impression that being in an open relationship was a selfish thing. Like yeah, I want you and want whoever else I want too. But the way you explain it, it's actually the opposite of selfish. There is a great deal of sacrifice on both sides - done with the hopes of ensuring your partners happiness.

Very illuminating. Thank you again Fade! :wink:

That isn't to say people haven't been polyamorous for selfish reasons, mind you. But my big long post was my personal experience/reasons :) Glad I was able to shed a little light on the topic, though
 

LovinThickWomen

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Why do some want a open relationship? Cause they have a crack n the relationship. And it's ending slowly. At that point they are just live together fuck buddies

I am in an open marriage and our decision had nothing to do with a crack in our relationship. We actually took 3 years talking about it and working out how it could happen before we actually took the plunge. I will say that our marriage has improved because of these talks. We speak more freely about other issues besides sex now.

The swinger friends we have are in better marriages then the ones who aren't. Saying people like us only do it because we have relationship issues already is a very narrow view on a fairly complex topic.
 

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Very helpful. Thank you so much. I was under the impression that being in an open relationship was a selfish thing. Like yeah, I want you and want whoever else I want too. But the way you explain it, it's actually the opposite of selfish. There is a great deal of sacrifice on both sides - done with the hopes of ensuring your partners happiness.

Very illuminating. Thank you again Fade! :wink:

Successful open relationships are based off of an honest desire to want your partner to be fulfilled and happy. The ones that fail are the ones that go into it for their own selfish reasons. Those failed relationships are generally doomed before they start this stuff. Open relationship just speeds up the process for them.
 

blazblue

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I am in an open marriage and our decision had nothing to do with a crack in our relationship. We actually took 3 years talking about it and working out how it could happen before we actually took the plunge. I will say that our marriage has improved because of these talks. We speak more freely about other issues besides sex now.

The swinger friends we have are in better marriages then the ones who aren't. Saying people like us only do it because we have relationship issues already is a very narrow view on a fairly complex topic.

Successful open relationships are based off of an honest desire to want your partner to be fulfilled and happy. The ones that fail are the ones that go into it for their own selfish reasons. Those failed relationships are generally doomed before they start this stuff. Open relationship just speeds up the process for them.

This.
 

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I think it's wrong.

If you love someone, the thought of another person being intimate with them is searingly viscerally painful, and don't let anyone tell you there's something wrong with you for feeling that way.

People talk a big talk about being open with these things, but in the end, you're playing in fire.
 
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I think it's wrong.

If you love someone, the thought of another person being intimate with them is searingly viscerally painful, and don't let anyone tell you there's something wrong with you for feeling that way.

People talk a big talk about being open with these things, but in the end, you're playing in fire.

For some people. There's nothing wrong with being strictly monogamous, but it seems a trifle rude to be so harsh about a lifestyle choice that you don't personally enjoy or participate in.

Would you say that being non-heterosexual is wrong as a heterosexual? I feel that the comparison is similar.
 

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I can understand and fulfill the need for my partner to occasionally seek out others and allowing me to do so as well but I would not like to know or share of any details.

I have heard of couples doing this sharing their experiences with their partner do the people on here do that as well?
 

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I think it's wrong.

If you love someone, the thought of another person being intimate with them is searingly viscerally painful, and don't let anyone tell you there's something wrong with you for feeling that way.

People talk a big talk about being open with these things, but in the end, you're playing in fire.

This is a genuine question, not only directed at Miscer, and I don't judge anyone for their feelings, but regarding the bolded part...

Why is it so painful for you if your SO is sexual with someone else?
 

Miscer

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For some people. There's nothing wrong with being strictly monogamous, but it seems a trifle rude to be so harsh about a lifestyle choice that you don't personally enjoy or participate in.

Would you say that being non-heterosexual is wrong as a heterosexual? I feel that the comparison is similar.

Your last comparison is absurd. There's absolutely nothing wrong with non-heterosexuality.

When people sleep together, most of the time there's an emotional connection. This spark can grow into a flame, whether you want it to or not. I have news for you. The majority of people cannot be in love with more than one person, and this is not "social programming". If you think you are in love with more than one person, then you don't know what true love is. And if you think your significant other will stay emotionally loyal to you while sleeping with others, you're living in a fantasy land.

This is a genuine question, not only directed at Miscer, and I don't judge anyone for their feelings, but regarding the bolded part...

Why is it so painful for you if your SO is sexual with someone else?

If you have to ask, you'll never understand.
 

Miscer

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One last thing I'll say: Sexual jealousy is an extremely dangerous and powerful force. If you think you can skate by espousing free love and other delusional nonsense (see: human history. See: collapse of free love communes. See: murder columns), then you are inviting misfortune and trouble into your life.

That said, if you find someone who has the same genetic brain wiring as you who can tolerate such a lifestyle, then go for it. Enjoy your life.
 

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It isn't for everyone. It takes a lot of effort and communication to make it work, as well as an open mind. I have a friend who looks down on people who have open relationships, yet he's never had a relationship that lasted more than 2 or 3 months and constants jumps from bed to bed when he's single. We've been together for 4 years, and outside encounters are infrequent, and discussed. We have great sex together, but our relationship isn't all about sex. If that was all we had in common we would have just been fuck buddies and left it at that.
 

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Believe it or not, I think it's much easier for homosexual (male) partners to live this lifestyle (open relationships). Much easier psychologically.

Where you run into trouble typically is with heterosexual partners and lesbian partners.

(I don't have the time to explain this in more detail, but it has nothing to do with social expectations, cultural conditioning, or social constructions.)
 
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Your last comparison is absurd. There's absolutely nothing wrong with non-heterosexuality.

When people sleep together, most of the time there's an emotional connection. This spark can grow into a flame, whether you want it to or not. I have news for you. The majority of people cannot be in love with more than one person, and this is not "social programming". If you think you are in love with more than one person, then you don't know what true love is. And if you think your significant other will stay emotionally loyal to you while sleeping with others, you're living in a fantasy land.

My comparison is no less ridiculous than you saying it's impossible for an individual to love more than one person at a time. True love is entirely subjective. Why so much dislike/condescension for something just because it isn't something to your liking?

I've had young/puppy love, I've had infatuation/lust, and I've had outright love/affection/companionship. My parents were married almost thirty years before she passed away. Their relationship is one of the strongest I've seen, ever. They also weren't strictly monogamous. My play partner and his wife have been married for over ten years. They still love/adore each other. I've also seen people married over 60 years who were monogamous/dedicated to each other since they got married in their early twenties. Different strokes for different folks.

I've never said that non-monogamy was for everyone. Why can't you be equally polite/open about people who aren't monogamous? If you can say there's nothing wrong with being gay as a heterosexual, why can't you as a monogamous person see there's nothing wrong with being non-monogamous? I'm not arguing/discussing/debating for trying to convert people to a lifestyle they don't want, either.

As you're so adamant about what is or isn't true, I want to ask you something. Are you an anthropologist, psychologist, therapist, social scientist, etc of some sort? Whether you are or aren't, where are you getting your data from? Is it just a visceral reaction or is it based off of information you can reference/quote/link?
 
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Miscer

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The fundamental mistake you're making is underplaying the emotional damage this stuff causes. I've seen lives get torn apart, even among people who stated they had an open mind and supported open relationships. Words are flimsy things.

I'm talking about broad patterns: most people are not made for open relationships. You're plucking anecdotes out and getting self-righteous.

Here's an observation that science will prove true one day: although men can sleep around and still love their partners, it's extremely difficult for a woman who's in love to nonchalantly sleep around. Rule of thumb: If your female partner is pushing for an open relationship, she's not in love with you.

And yeah I'm one of those things you mentioned, and I don't have time to dig up my data/currently very busy and coming here in between breaks. Maybe another time, I'd be glad to drop some empirical data
 

LovinThickWomen

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I think it's wrong.

If you love someone, the thought of another person being intimate with them is searingly viscerally painful, and don't let anyone tell you there's something wrong with you for feeling that way.

People talk a big talk about being open with these things, but in the end, you're playing in fire.

I think you misunderstand that while it may be wrong for you, it is not wrong for everyone. I love my wife dearly, and I have never been a jealous person. Just because you or people like you can't do it, doesn't make it wrong...

Being intimate with someone else isn't painful, sex was meant to be for both fun and reproduction. Now that our reproduction is finished it is meant to be fun! Our idea of fun and your idea will be different. Doesn't make one or the other wrong...

If I had to live in a monogamous relationship I would be bored out of my mind! If you enjoy that, more power to ya~
 
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The fundamental mistake you're making is underplaying the emotional damage this stuff causes. I've seen lives get torn apart, even among people who stated they had an open mind and supported open relationships. Words are flimsy things.

I'm talking about broad patterns: most people are not made for open relationships. You're plucking anecdotes out and getting self-righteous.

Here's an observation that science will prove true one day: although men can sleep around and still love their partners, it's extremely difficult for a woman who's in love to nonchalantly sleep around. Rule of thumb: If your female partner is pushing for an open relationship, she's not in love with you.

And yeah I'm one of those things you mentioned, and I don't have time to dig up my data/currently very busy and coming here in between breaks. Maybe another time, I'd be glad to drop some empirical data

I'm not saying that bad shit doesn't happen sometimes because of non-monogamous relationships.

At the same time, people can have just as fucked up of a relationship/emotional distress/damage in a monogamous relationship. I'm only feeling indignant because you seem to be dismissive of a lifestyle that other people are happy with, just because you don't agree with.

As for the whole men can sleep around and still love someone and women can't, I've heard the whole "male imperative" argument I don't even know how many times. Yes I know that in broad, sweeping, overwhelmingly generalizing terms that men typically have a higher sex drive. Men can fuck people without getting attached. The list goes on and on. :rolleyes: Even so, there are exceptions to almost anything.