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DC_DEEP

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Thank you, Kotch. I'm glad that at least you didn't take offense at my opening post and go on the defensive. I appreciate and understand your explanations. That was my sole point in starting this thread.

(To all:) I have never claimed that I thought LPSG was a democracy; in fact, the opposite is true. I have always understood that this site is privately owned, and the owner, for better or worse, makes the rules. All the rules. I don't have any problem with that at all.

As for the semi-snarky comments about whether or not I paid for my gold membership: that's something that should not have been brought up in the public forum, right? For what it's worth, as soon as the gold membership policy was instituted (way back when the only way to get it was purchase) I paid for it. I rarely look at the galleries, they have never held much interest for me. I have plenty of jerk-off material at home, in real life... I don't need to get it online. So why did I get a gold membership? I enjoyed the site, and wanted to support it. Period.

Why did I stop paying for gold membership? Not that it's anyone's business, but here goes. Quite literally one day after I had renewed my gold membership, and fairly new troll (whose username means "turd") was getting on my nerves, demanding that the long-term members stop posting in a thread he deemed "done to death." I told him to mind his own business, and stop telling people where and when they may post. Some of the moderators gave me a warning. I asked that my gold membership be cancelled and my money refunded, as it had been less than 24 hours since I renewed. The gold membership was rescinded, but the money was not refunded.

I have been warned twice about taking two specific trolls to task, and I got temp-banned another time for taking another (obviously recycled) troll to task. In the end, they have all shown their true colors and have been permanently banned. But with all the veil of secrecy that some of the mods seem to enjoy, the appearance to the general membership is that trolls tend to be favored over long-standing, well-respected members. Whether that's the case or not, that's the appearance.

The moderating and administrative teams could, without divulging any sensitive information, make a whole lot of what they do a whole lot more transparent. In the long run, that would prevent a whole lot of grief and discontent.

It's been jammed in my face several times that "it's Rob's site, he can do what he wants to." That's fine. I know that already. I understand it. I've never claimed that this place is a democracy, and in fact, have corrected some of the more idiotic posts claiming "violations of first amendment right to free speech." This is not a government entity, so the first amendment does not apply. I get that. However, I cannot imagine that he is stupid, though, and the very best business model would seem to revolve around the mantra, "keep the clientele happy."
 

Lex

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...Maybe you need to do a stint as a moderator in the current climate and you might just see what I'm talking about.
Many of us who have been moderators understand what it takes and still don't agree with everything that happens and the way it goes down. Its not as much about a person as it is about a system. Kotch really said it best. She has been a mod before and is now an admin--that does not mean she has to blindly agree with every single way the system works.

....
So why do it?

Possibly to make the moderators look like overbearing and heavy handed chumps, playing favorites and covering our asses when what we've done is procedure?

Clever plan really.

Most of you bought it.

Well, some of us have worked with some of you as current or former mods. And in those cases, there is really nothing to "buy." Rather, there are simply facts and opinions to confirm and affirm.
 

B_Hickboy

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DC DEEP, I gave you credit for being smart enough to realize that will not happen. I will not be silenced, especially by the likes of you.

Your childish emotional attachment to winning arguments and having the last word prevents you from being objective. Your posts in this thread are full of subjective personal preferences expressed as objective pronouncements. What you don't realize, much to my ongoing entertainment, is that your whims and wishes just don't carry as much weight as you believe and wish they did.

But it's all right, Phaëthon, just keep driving daddy's car with your foot to the floor. You'll get where you're supposed to be, and I'll be there to have another chuckle. You're like a Keystone Kops movie.
 
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DC_DEEP

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DC DEEP, I gave you credit for being smart enough to realize that will not happen. I will not be silenced, especially by the likes of you.

Your childish emotional attachment to winning arguments and having the last word prevents you from being objective. Your posts in this thread are full of subjective personal preferences expressed as objective pronouncements. What you don't realize, much to my ongoing entertainment, is that your whims and wishes just don't carry as much weight as you believe and wish they did.

But it's all right, Phaëthon, just keep driving daddy's car with your foot to the floor. You'll get where you're supposed to be, and I'll be there to have another chuckle. You're like a Keystone Kops movie.
I have no childish emotional attachment to anything, thank you very much. In your usual dysfunctional manner, you saw "winning an argument" where there was no argument. I'll not be silenced by the likes of you, either. I will voice my opinions as I see fit.

You are just as much an idiot now as you ever have been. But go ahead and retort, as I know you must have the last word, and I would hate to deprive you of your one joy in life. :rolleyes:

Why don't you go back to making some of your more brilliant threads, like this one?
 

Gillette

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You've just confirmed for me that your reading skills are selective.

Not only did I not miss JasonEls mention of open letters I responded to it in the very same post you've quoted me as having missed it in.

If it was meant for a public discussion why was it titled "Moderators, Rob, BAN..." ?

Strikes me as disingenuous. Perhaps so, perhaps not.

Did you miss jason_els's post about 'open letters'? I'm not being sarky - he really did explain it very well. Often I have seen 'open letters' published in newspapers, to heads of state, heads of institutions, et cetera. It is an established form.

You mention the historical cases of this. Can you honestly not intuit that those instances were also to drive public opinion and put additional pressure on the decision makers?

Get glasses.
 

Gillette

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Well, some of us have worked with some of you as current or former mods. And in those cases, there is really nothing to "buy." Rather, there are simply facts and opinions to confirm and affirm.

You've lied outright about moderator actions.
You've been on my case since I proved you were lying by posting the actual vote over a particular case.
You've stalked out of your mod position in true prima donna form (twice is it?) rather than make the hard choice to suck it up and try to keep pushing for change from the inside.

Your 'facts' are spotty.
Your opinion is irrelevant.
 

ManlyBanisters

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You've just confirmed for me that your reading skills are selective.

Not only did I not miss JasonEls mention of open letters I responded to it in the very same post you've quoted me as having missed it in.



Get glasses.

Reading skills and being able to physically read text do not equate to the same thing. It seemed to me, from the lines I quoted, that you had completely missed the point of his entire post. I made a point of saying I was not posting to annoy you and in return you have made a point of insulting me. To what end, Gillette? Because we've crossed swords in the past I try to ensure that you know when my intentions are not negative towards you personally. You choose to ignore that and attack me personally. Why? Are you incapable of dealing with each interaction on its own merits?
 

Gillette

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Reading skills and being able to physically read text do not equate to the same thing. It seemed to me, from the lines I quoted, that you had completely missed the point of his entire post. I made a point of saying I was not posting to annoy you and in return you have made a point of insulting me. To what end, Gillette? Because we've crossed swords in the past I try to ensure that you know when my intentions are not negative towards you personally. You choose to ignore that and attack me personally. Why? Are you incapable of dealing with each interaction on its own merits?

You suggest that I missed a point that I had in fact addressed.

If you read that but chose not to quote it, instead implying that I was the one 'missing' something then you were being dishonest.

Your selectivity in this interaction does not suggest positive intent.



"I'm not posting to annoy you but I'm going to pretend you didn't address a point so that I can say you missed it"?

Really?
 
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ManlyBanisters

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Well - you have misunderstood my intent - and not for the first time.

I did not post what I posted because I was talking to Gillette - there was no pretence. I posted what I posted because you genuinely seemed to have missed the point. The part I quoted was totally at odds with the explanation - there is nothing disingenuous about a public letter. I apologise if you took that personally and reiterate that an ad hominem attack was not intended.

I do believe you responded the way you did not just because of the content of my post but also, and mainly, because I posted it. Disappointing, I thought we were past that.
 

Gillette

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Well - you have misunderstood my intent - and not for the first time.

I did not post what I posted because I was talking to Gillette - there was no pretence. I posted what I posted because you genuinely seemed to have missed the point. The part I quoted was totally at odds with the explanation - there is nothing disingenuous about a public letter. I apologise if you took that personally and reiterate that an ad hominem attack was not intended.

I do believe you responded the way you did not just because of the content of my post but also, and mainly, because I posted it. Disappointing, I thought we were past that.

You didn't say that you disagreed with my response to Jason's Point. You asked if I had missed his post altogether. Backtracking and altering your stance only makes you look disingenuous.

I think it is you who has missed my point.

I addressed Jason's point about the open letters because it reinforces what I said earlier. Addressing it to the decision makers but distributing it to the entire public IS a move to sway public opinion into pressuring said decision makers.

Doing so in a post you acknowledge contains a violation and will likely be removed so that it's very removal adds to the smoke and mirrors conspiracy of moderator heavy handedness is a very crafty manoever, indeed.

I would very much like to play chess with her.
 

ManlyBanisters

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OK - Gillette - whatever you say. Missed the post , missed the point, missed the fucking boat. Now you say I am 'backtracking' and you aren't even acknowledging that I've apologised for unintentional offence.

You are determined to argue. I am not.

I shan't bother trying with you again.
 

MASSIVEPKGO_CHUCK

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Easy there, Manly Bannisters, we know you're being the bigger person by trying to diffuse this as quick as possible- you shouldn't let an instigator get on your nerves like this.

Just be content you had the notion to stop when you did. We all applaud you for that, well, at least I do.:wink::kiss::hug:
 

simcha

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...
Possibly to make the moderators look like overbearing and heavy handed chumps, playing favorites and covering our asses when what we've done is procedure?

Clever plan really.

Most of you bought it.

And you geniuses on the moderating/adminstrative team took the bait; hook, line, and sinker. So, what does that make you? :eek:
 

D_Theophallus Kneedgroin

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I've posted similar threads, and they were shitcanned, or at least removed from view. At the time, I didn't make a public whine of it, nor did I feel I needed anybody else to jump to my defense. But then again, I'm not a nubile twentysomething female whom a lot of people want to have sex with. OH, and did I mention the fact that I see it as the owners and moderators' right to do as they see fit with posts, mine included, so I don't give a shit what happens to something after I write it? Almost all of my posts here have been done with the purpose of eliciting a response from the reader. I have chased a lot of people's compulsions into the light of day and had quite a few belly laughs from it. And judging from the PMs I get, I'm not the only one who gets a chuckle out of the responses. So I don't give a shit what the other members think. I'm not here looking for friends, and the ones I've found here have been purely by accident. I have F&B friends who understand what the word "love" means. If I were here looking for any kind of fulfillment at an emotional level I'd have long ago grown a pair and shot myself. I came here to giggle at people who are easily manipulated, and have hit the jackpot.

When I walk into a restaurant and people are behaving in a fashion I don't approve of I leave. If those people happen to be managers or owners, I still leave. I go somewhere that I can be comfortable. I don't sit around and whinge about the way the place is run. I up and fucking leave. I don't sit around and demand that those whose behavior offends me explain themselves. I just get the fuck out and find a place that suits me.

I see a really interesting phenomenon at LPSG and a few other sites I frequent. People stay here and bitch, rather than get the fuck out. These are the same people who wouldn't hesitate to leave a restaurant/bar/party/whorehouse/grocery store if they were offended, but they stay here and they grind on and on and on with their endless, mind-numbingly repetitious criticisms of LPSG and the way it's managed. It's fucking strange. If I cared to know, I would ask why, but others' motivations is not something I really concern myself with. If their behavior is having a negative effect on me, I let them know. If they can't give me what I need, I seek to have my needs met elsewhere rather than stay where I feel I'm being abused and insist that others change to accomodate me.

Net-net: Whining about this place and the way it's run is just poor form. It's rude, obnoxious, and counter-productive. Unless you LIKE hanging out and pissing off the people who are extending you their hospitality. If that's the case, well, you're doing a good job.

But if you assume the right to insult your host, your host reserves the right to throw your gormless ass out.

This is a private business enterprise. Its owner has the right to do as he pleases with its content. Don't abuse words like "censorship" when speaking of what goes on here. Grow up and try to understand that when you insult your host he has the right to dispose of your writings and your account as he pleases.

Don't cheapen the concept of free speech by getting into an argument about the deletion of what you say by those who find it offensive and are in a position to rid the board of said content. There may be cases where I would defend what you have to say, but their prerogative to delete what you write trumps all. People have fought and died defending my right to free speech. Don't dishonor their sacrifices by mentioning it within this context; it just...doesn't...FIT!!! If you don't like what happens here, the web is glutted with free blogspaces where you can set up your own forum and bash away at whomever or whatever you choose as a target. When a thread disappears, you abuse the concept of "rights" when you say that your "rights" have somehow been violated by the person or persons who deleted it. Most of it's drivel, anyway.

I've been a member of this board for almost four years and have yet to read anything here that I felt remotely deserved to be recorded for posterity. There may be some self-important, self-aggrandizing, narcisstic cunts who disagree with me, but I just don't give a shit what you think. You, and whatever passes for thought in your confused little brain, are not as important as you believe.

The problem we have here isn't with deleted posts. The problem lies in a generalized lack of respect for ideas, and a great deal of confusion about what an idea actually is. HERE'S the big IDEA: PRIVATE PROPERTY.

I don't expect any of you to get it. Just keep wallowing in your barbaric ignorance.

I get it :wink:

and couldn't agree with you more
 

Freddie53

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nudeyorker: In this instance it is a case of putting something in the correct forum. The purpose of this thread {AlteredEgo's} was for moderators and administrators not member discussion.

--------------------


For the record, I received a PM from the thread's author (a response to my original PM inquiring what the hell happened to her thread) that indicated it was indeed a thread for LPSG public consumption (if you will), not merely for administrative eyes only.
Without a doubt she meant for the public to see it. However, It was addressed to the mods and the owner Rob E. Do you really think there was any possibility that the owner Rob was going to discuss whether or not Jason should be banned? Really? And list all the reasons? Have a mod and owner directed "Let's see who can come up with the most dirt on Jason" thread? Not a chance in hell. If I had conducted the thread, you can be sure you wouldn't see mod by my name anymore. You might have even seened the word banned there.

Those who have a history here fully know how Rob feels about having open court on the pubic forum of a member here in that fashoin. The author of the thread I'm quite sure knew as well. It is not going to happen. If it starts, you will see another thread disappear.

You can agree with this or not. It isn't my call and it isn't your call. It is solely in the hands of the owner. I've been in many restaurants that were badly managed, prices too high, food not worth paying for etc. What did I do? I chose to eat and pay for my meals elsewhere. I might say something in passing as I walked out. But I don't beleive the owner of the restaurant is going to allow me to lead a discussion of what is wrong with the steaks, which items are over priced etc with a mic in hand and all the customers joining in. Not going to happen at the restaurant. It is not going to happen here either.

There is more to the story than meets the eye. A lot more. There is a tangled web going back seveal years. There has been enough back stabing, half truths and such going on now for a lifetime. Most of it isn't done right here on the public forum. There are rumors that go from one person to another via pm and other sources. We have other sites, blogs and such to add to the mixture. The best of saints get drawn into the drama as well as the worst hellions. Sometimes it is difficult to separate the characters into the two groups.

A lot more drama than meets the eye. It is overwhelming at times the drama that as come to be known as the LPSG. It would be expensive, but it might make a good soap opera.

Sometimes it is best just to sit back and enjoy the ride while watching the drama unfold.