thanksgiving is nonsense
- Thread starter B_tallbig
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side note: why do we call the early Puritan immigrants to this country "pilgrims?" They weren't on a pilgrimage anywhere... they were just squatters.
Osiris
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That is a sentiment I can understand and accept. Although I do have to disagree. I feel that through my faith that if I see someone in need, it is my place to try and help as I can and where I can. That is how we pass the blessings along. Pay it forward as you will.
I guess my religious belief and my truly logical belief clash in some way on this issue. I may thank God or giving me the breath of life and a mind to think, but it is through my own fortitude and drive that I have achieved my blessings and fortune and as such, I need to share them with those less fortunate how and when I can.
I know this probably sounds convaluted, but it's how I feel. Thank you for stating your point in a non-insulting and respectful way as always friend.
- 36DD,
I don't celebrate Thanksgiving as a holiday anymore becaused it's too painful and being with others just serves to remind me of its intensity and presence right now; however, I am thankful. I understand you are coming from the position of disbelief in the existence of a God who could allow such misfortune to some and blessings to others. Fine; but I do not understand why you find it egocentric for someone who believes in God to give thanks to God. How is that being selfish? If I were to say that you were being selfish because you don't understand something, wouldn't that be selfish of me to expect you to have the same beliefs? Yes. I believe in God but I do not put my belief in an unjust world. Just bear with me, I am trying to explain. Now if I believe in God as my creator, then obviously he is intelligent enough to create me, right? So if I believe he has the intelligence capable of creating me, then I must also believe he has more insight into matters that I do not understand. Based on that belief, how can I then assume to understand his ways or reasonings? Simple: I don't. What I can say is that I am thankful for the blessings and the lessons I have learned from the misfortunes...not the misfortunes themselves. You are arguing your belief on logic, but faith is not logical. Faith is a difficult concept to grasp even for one who holds it; faith is not an understanding based on logic, it just is.
Actually we arent created by god . We are born by our parents. And our parents by their parents and so on. Saying that god created the universe imply that he create all what exist as it is with the good things and the bad things as well.
Well i understand you belief not problem but what i said in my previous post isnt base on belief just on reality . We exist only by our parents .
- 36DD,
I'm going by my belief...yes I know it is reality that we are borne of our parents...no sex ed needed here!
I hate Thanksgiving dinner, no matter who makes it. I hate holidays. I hate commercialization and materialism. I don't hate my immediate family, though. LOL.
I know lots of people who hate holidays. Why? Many reasons:
1)getting with family members you rarely see as well as hate can be bring about a lot of unhappy feelings
2)commercialization
3)Suicides are more common around the holidays (very depressing to hear about)
4)stress of buying gifts
5)overspending
and the "et la liste continue..."
Every year I always see articles about "how do cope with holiday stress". Hell, if it's that stressful, the holiday season should be canceled.
I know lots of people who hate holidays. Why? Many reasons:
1)getting with family members you rarely see as well as hate can be bring about a lot of unhappy feelings
2)commercialization
3)Suicides are more common around the holidays (very depressing to hear about)
4)stress of buying gifts
5)overspending
and the "et la liste continue..."
Every year I always see articles about "how do cope with holiday stress". Hell, if it's that stressful, the holiday season should be canceled.
B_Italian1
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I agree with that and expressed it earlier.
I'm not sure why you would use the words "deplorable egocentrism" to describe people who have faith, but later on you capitalize God and Him. You're kind of a believer but not really--Agnostic possibly.
Well... that makes a lot more sense than, say, Star Jones thanking God for saving her fat ass from the Christmas tsunami a couple years ago. Thanking God for life and free will... that's the same thing he gives to everyone so there's nothing implied there that I was suggesting. and I think it's great that you recognize your own contributions to whatever success you achieve, and admirable that you'd wish to share the fruits of your labor and food fortune.
Not convoluted at all.
old habits die hard. I'm one of the lost sheep of God's flock.
I already said this but maybe it was lost in the shuffle of the other things I was saying. If you are thanking God for your wealth or good health or full belly, then you are by extension also thanking Him for depriving others of these things. Otherwise, without the context of a shitty world full of suffering, you would have no idea of what to be thankful for. You can say "thank God we're not starving like those poor souls in Darfur." But.... how would you know to be thankful for that, unless there were poor souls starving in Darfur? If you believe that God has a hand in supplying you with food, and you must if you are giving thanks to Him, then you must also believe that He has a hand in depriving these other people right? Or at the very least, you believe that He chose to provide you with food, and made the choice not to do the same for the world's hungry. This seems very egocentric, to think that you're getting special favor from God.
Isn't part of thanksgiving to give thanks to the American natives who gave the pilgrims food, I think it's a bit two faced to be giving thanks to someone whose land you then stole.
I'm ducking
I'm ducking
- 36DD,
I don't think that I am getting special favor at all, that's not what I was saying, just trying to explain why I can still be thankful in the midst of everything but I guess you are not understanding that. And I said you can't understand it because you apply logic to it when faith is illogical. If you are to say I am egocentric because my thanksgiving makes sense to me and not to you, then it would be the same as my saying you are egocentric to think that because you don't hold the same idea as me that you are right and everyone else like me is wrong. I hope I explained that well enough. Sometimes I wish I had a chalkboard so I could draw diagrams...and no that is not an insult, just wish I had a chalkboard.I don't attempt to understand God, I just believe that his mind is far more capable of making sense out of things than I am.
you're absolutely right. Faith is completely absolutely illogical. If you embrace this fact, then why are you trying to defend your faith in the face of my logic? That seems highly illogical.
I'll pray that God grants you a chalkboard.
I'll pray that God grants you a chalkboard.
but now they have casinos so its all good lolIsn't part of thanksgiving to give thanks to the American natives who gave the pilgrims food, I think it's a bit two faced to be giving thanks to someone whose land you then stole.
I'm ducking
